# Chef -Respect or Arrogance?



## Sprout (Mar 22, 2011)

We have a gentleman who owns several restaurants and occasionally dines at the establishment I serve at. He seems a wee bit cocky, but is polite and friendly as long as everything is going his way, so his attitude is fairly typical for someone his age (late 20s) who is successful and reasonably good-looking. Here is my question. Our owner knows him by first and last name, as do our manager and a couple members of our staff who went to high school with him or have waited on him several times, yet he always insists on his reservation being listed as "Chef Firstname." (it's probably obvious, but just in case, Firstname is not his real first name) 

I'm truly curious. Is it typical for a Chef to use the title outside of work? And in another's restaurant? I would venture to guess that at least half of our regular clientele is made up of people who could make their reservations under "Dr. So-and-so," but we rarely see formal titles on the reservation list. Is it a matter of respect for him to carry the title everywhere, or arrogance? 
Just curious to see other's opinions, especially from other chefs!


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## Rocklobster (Mar 22, 2011)

I think he just wants to be noticed. He is there as a diner. Nothing more.
Not to be too negative here, but there is something about the culinary arts that can bring out the arrogance in people. I find many chefs to be like this. But, to be fair, there are many talented and down to earth, modest chefs out there. Although it takes time, effort and commitment to be a chef, so do most other trades or careers. Maybe next time I make a reservation I will make it under Musician/certified cook Roch.


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## Sprout (Mar 22, 2011)

Rocklobster said:


> Maybe next time I make a reservation I will make it under Musician/certified cook Roch.



Think I should mention my CPR certification under my next reservation? JK


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## taxlady (Mar 22, 2011)

Maybe he is being considerate and giving everyone a "heads up" that a chef is coming. Maybe the chef in the restaurant would like to know if she/he is cooking for a chef.


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## GB (Mar 22, 2011)

taxlady said:


> Maybe he is being considerate and giving everyone a "heads up" that a chef is coming. Maybe the chef in the restaurant would like to know if she/he is cooking for a chef.


Why should that matter? Shouldn't a chef cook the same for every one of their customers regardless of their profession?


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## roadfix (Mar 22, 2011)

Rocklobster said:


> Not to be too negative here, but there is something about the culinary arts that can bring out the arrogance in people. I find many chefs to be like this.



Not only in the culinary arts, as I find this to be true in several other professions as well.  Take hair dressers for instance.  I don't do hair but I am in the salon business and deal with arrogant stylists (my employees) daily.


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## taxlady (Mar 22, 2011)

GB said:


> Why should that matter? Shouldn't a chef cook the same for every one of their customers regardless of their profession?



Well I think so. Maybe the chef will want to plate it a little more carefully.

Maybe ask the restaurant's chef what she/he thinks of it?


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## Andy M. (Mar 22, 2011)

In the old days he would be called a stuffed shirt.  These days he'd be called arrogant.


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## Kayelle (Mar 22, 2011)

> Our owner knows him by first and last name, as do our manager and a  couple members of our staff who went to high school with him or have  waited on him several times, yet he always insists on his reservation  being listed as "Chef Firstname."



Based on that sentence alone, I'd bet he must be really full of himself.  Ack..whata pita....   If he's only in his 20's maybe he just has some growing up to do, or his Mama didn't teach him well.


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## Claire (Mar 22, 2011)

Yes, it is the same in may professions, but has to be irking when someone insists upon it with his peers.  And people think the military was bad!  I've seen worse rank consciousness in education and in science than I ever saw a general insist on!


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## Silversage (Mar 22, 2011)

For many years, I have belonged to an organization that includes a predominance of members with advanced degrees and professional credentials.  Quite a few of them list all the alphabet soup on all the membership lists, reservations, etc.

The editor of our newsletter thought it was getting so ridiculous that she started listing herself on the masthead as Firstname Lastname, BFD.

It caused more than a minor commotion.

Every group has people who are very impressed with themselves.


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## taxlady (Mar 22, 2011)

Silversage said:


> For many years, I have belonged to an organization that includes a predominance of members with advanced degrees and professional credentials.  Quite a few of them list all the alphabet soup on all the membership lists, reservations, etc.
> 
> The editor of our newsletter thought it was getting so ridiculous that she started listing herself on the masthead as Firstname Lastname, BFD.
> 
> ...



I don't understand the "BFD".


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## GB (Mar 22, 2011)

Big F'n Deal


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## roadfix (Mar 22, 2011)

...lol...


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## Andy M. (Mar 22, 2011)

Boston Fire Department?


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## joesfolk (Mar 22, 2011)

It is just my opinion but I wonder if perhaps he is just a little unsure of himself.  I find that people who have earned a title but who have not spent a lot of time proving themselves seem to be very insistant about the use of the title.  The old timers who have nothing to prove tend to be less insistant.


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## taxlady (Mar 22, 2011)

GB said:


> Big F'n Deal



Thanks.

I was told that

BS = Bull Sxxx
MS = More Sxxx
Phd = Piled Higher and Deeper


When needed, I use DGTP - danged good tax preparer


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## PrincessFiona60 (Mar 22, 2011)

How arrogant, it's just ridiculous.

PrincessFiona60 HRH, RN, BSN


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## GrillingFool (Mar 22, 2011)

My wife recently earned her Phd in plant genetics. When she makes reservations, she makes them as DR. So-and-So.

Her reasoning is that she put 6 long hard years into earning the degree and the title,
and she damn sure is going to use it when she can.
(Also, a title before or after a name does cause a mental shift in most people's thinking... it does command a bit more respect.)

However, if she ends up being booked as Mrs., she doesn't much worry about it.

So, although I tend to agree it is rather arrogant if one INSISTS, I can understand it.


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## buckytom (Mar 23, 2011)

i think what's bothersome to me is that it's typical for successful, young guys to be arrogant. 

i see it in almost all of the group of 20 somethings with whom i work. i guess it's the "jersey shore" generation. you don't need class or too much intelligence if you make good money and work out a lot. unfortunately, young women facilitate that - feeding right into it, so they're no better.

the few young guys in my job who are decent, relatively humble people are already slated to be the future managers and supervisors, but we can't tell them that or it might go to their heads and ruin everything, lol.


as far as the "chef" goes, i guess he feels that he'll get special service in some way if his background is known by the waitstaff and cooks/chef. i'm sure it's worked at times, so why not try?

the real question is does he call himself chef outside of the restaurant biz where it might mean less. i mean, i work with a lot of "engineers". some do nothing more than push a button or two once in a while, when told to do so. some have multiple degrees and many years of experience and run a television network. the term engineer losses it's cachet after a while when you compare the two.

in the real world, a chef might be a talented, rising culinary star, or could be a burger flipper extroadinaire, you never know.


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## Bolas De Fraile (Mar 23, 2011)

Before I retired one of the companies I was a director of sponsored a premier league soccer team, we had a table for lunch before the game, the 2 Michelin starred chef Paul Heathcote was a regular, we talked about women, soccer, women, women and womens netball never about food his job or mine. He like a lot of restrant owners is having a hard time because of the economy and has sold or closed about 7 of his groupHeathcotes


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## MSC (Mar 23, 2011)

I think you have some clues here to his 'personality', as he's insisting on the "Chef" appellation in front of people he knows and went to school with, so add egotism and inflated self-importance to the arrogance accusations.
Usually in this type of scenario, it'll only take one or two people, seen to be laughing at him before the pretension is reduced to embarrassment.  In 'extreme' cases, that means the restaurant would lose a customer...and suspect that occurrence would be listed under the heading of "aw shucks"!


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## GB (Mar 23, 2011)

This reminds me of the Seinfeld episode where Elaine was dating the Maestro who insisted on being called Maestro.


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## blissful (Mar 23, 2011)

Friends of my parents, this man (and his wife), invited us to dinner at his place. He was the most humble man, so sweet, never put on airs, turns out they were pretty weathy (with no need to flaunt it), he was one of the best cooks/chefs I knew (as his hobby). I miss him since he passed away. He is the kind of person that makes the difference between an amazing person (and chef) and a truly annoying one.




GB said:


> Who are you? How did you get in here?
> I'm a locksmith and I'm a locksmith.


 
GB, I'm having a slow morning, what does it mean, I'm a locksmith and I'm a locksmith? Help me!


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## GB (Mar 23, 2011)

blissful said:


> GB, I'm having a slow morning, what does it mean, I'm a locksmith and I'm a locksmith? Help me!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRva7z8pvwc&feature=youtube_gdata_player


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## blissful (Mar 23, 2011)

GB said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRva7z8pvwc&feature=youtube_gdata_player


  THANK YOU.


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## lisareneethepainter (Mar 23, 2011)

I was a professional chef for 25 years and never used my title or thought I'd be treated any differently. In fact, it used to irk me when a server would announce they had a "VIP" because I tried to cook and present my best food with every plate. When you cook with love, there are no real worries. He just has low self esteem, is poaching quality servers, or is bragging and get a date with you


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## jennyema (Mar 23, 2011)

It is fairly common for chefs to colloquially call each other "chef."

But insisting that he be referred to as "Chef BFD" when he is booking a reservation suggests maturity and self confidence issues.


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## Sprout (Mar 23, 2011)

taxlady said:


> Maybe ask the restaurant's chef what she/he thinks of it?




I don't recall his exact words, but I know they didn't resemble "What a humble guy!"


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## Claire (Mar 23, 2011)

Out of curiousity, is there an actual ranking (besides stars, triangles and wedges in guide books and reviews), say a test you have to take, a standard, etc to "earn" the title of chef, or can, say, the head cook at my favorite restaurant, or the owner of the restaurant (who, yes, did start it and cook in it, but no longer does), etc .... who can claim the title.  For example, a PhD has earned the title of doctor, a person of military rank (exception:  Kentucky Colonel), has had to go before a review board, go before congress or take tests (depending on rank), teaching has standards for Professorial status.  Do chefs have any objective standards?

Just curious.


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## taxlady (Mar 23, 2011)

Claire said:


> Out of curiousity, is there an actual ranking (besides stars, triangles and wedges in guide books and reviews), say a test you have to take, a standard, etc to "earn" the title of chef, or can, say, the head cook at my favorite restaurant, or the owner of the restaurant (who, yes, did start it and cook in it, but no longer does), etc .... who can claim the title.  For example, a PhD has earned the title of doctor, a person of military rank (exception:  Kentucky Colonel), has had to go before a review board, go before congress or take tests (depending on rank), teaching has standards for Professorial status.  Do chefs have any objective standards?
> 
> Just curious.



A friend of mine's mother was a chef. She had to renew her Ontario chef's license every 10 years.


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## Andy M. (Mar 23, 2011)

Chef basically means "Chief - the guy who runs the kitchen".  That includes hiring and firing, planning, ordering, directing the staff and everything else.  

There are subordinate chefs such as sous chef, pastry chef, fry chef, etc.  They all report to the head chef.


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## Silversage (Mar 23, 2011)

The only actual ranking that is tested and judged is Master Chef.  It is a tough program requiring knowledge, experience and skill.  Not many actually achieve it.


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## simonbaker (Mar 23, 2011)

Arrogance runs high in the restaurant business, he must have a hard time seperating work from personal.


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## Bolas De Fraile (Mar 24, 2011)

simonbaker said:


> Arrogance runs high in the restaurant business


That is because we are mere morsels
Ps how did the tests go?


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## MSC (Mar 24, 2011)

Claire said:


> Out of curiousity, is there an actual ranking (besides stars, triangles and wedges in guide books and reviews), say a test you have to take, a standard, etc to "earn" the title of chef, or can, say, the head cook at my favorite restaurant, or the owner of the restaurant (who, yes, did start it and cook in it, but no longer does), etc .... who can claim the title.  For example, a PhD has earned the title of doctor, a person of military rank (exception:  Kentucky Colonel), has had to go before a review board, go before congress or take tests (depending on rank), teaching has standards for Professorial status.  Do chefs have any objective standards?
> 
> Just curious.


That's a complex question, claire, will try to give an overview.
First of all, legally speaking, there are no 'chef police' who will go after individuals calling themselves chefs, so as to your question, anybody can call themselves a chef if they have qualifications or not.
The largest organization in the U.S. for pro chefs is the ACF, the American Culinary Federation, with several thousand members and chapters all over the States.  They do "certify" chefs and provide continuing education and competitions.  There are many pro chefs who won't join the ACF because they feel they're too insular with a high degree of political infighting.
The other well-known organization that 'recognizes' pro chefs for their merits and awards them, is the James Beard Foundation, out of New York.
There are other organizations, domestic and international, who run certification programs so there are many ways  career chefs can add to their resumes.
Still, anybody can, and often do, call themselves "chefs" without formal training or certification, and can do it with impunity.


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## Bolas De Fraile (Mar 24, 2011)

The best Chef Police are the public they take action with their feet, food critics hold massive sway as well.


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## Rocklobster (Mar 24, 2011)

I have a Cerified Cook Certificate. I am liscenced by the Provincial Board of Trades. I needed 2000 hours work and to pass a test with over a 75% mark. If I wanted I could go for my Chefs certification. I think I would have to have 5000 work hours(which I surpassed years ago) and have to do a couple of exams, practical and written. I walked in off the street and paid my 60 dollars to write the exam. My certification is equivilent to anybody who graduates from a two year, full time course in community college in this country. Which seems like a bit of a racket to me.

I never bothered. Instead I just bought my own restaurant in '94. I had worked under many Chefs before and their lifestyle didn't look like it was my cup of tea. And I knew it wasn't going to be the way I wanted to go with my future.
I managed a kitchen after closing my place 4 years ago and the owner always called me chef. It bothered me because it sounded a bit pretentious. But, I also think he did it because he could never remember my name. lol!!


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## simonbaker (Mar 24, 2011)

Bolas De Fraile said:


> That is because we are mere morsels
> Ps how did the tests go?


 I am so relived that I am not diabetic....My cholesterol is to high as well as my trigliserides. I am very commited to my lifestyle change. I have lost 12 pounds. I need to lose about 90 more, but hopefully next year at this time I will achieve my goal. 
Thank you so much for your support & wealth of information that you have shared with me. I am very grateful.


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## babetoo (Mar 25, 2011)

Bolas De Fraile said:


> That is because we are mere morsels
> Ps how did the tests go?


 

did you mean mere mortals? on some level it works with morsels. lol


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