# Hand Mixing Woes



## Brooksy (Sep 16, 2004)

Well I took the advice of a few of you and my results were darn awful.

I had a slack day yesterday so I decided to give hand mixing a go - and what a failure.  My intention was to make 3 X 500gm (1lb) loaves using the same recipe but using different techniques.  The 3 techniques were:
1. By hand mixed & kneaded
2. Bread maker mixed dough
3. A mixture of hand and machine.

The recipe used was a standard white loaf:
300gms flour
180ml water
20 mls oil (Macadamia)
1.5 tspn salt
1.5 tspn yeast
2 tspn sugar

Flour constituents were:
2 Tbspn Gluten Flour (80% protein)
1 tspn Bread Improver (95% soya flour etc)
Topped up with AP Flour

I started by hand and ended up with flour all over the kitchen, the wife right off her rocker, a cracked window, tired arms, bruised pride and crook bread. I could not work the dough to a smooth, soft consistency. Hard as a rock. Very disappointing.
The hybrid method, proved a little more successful, but again, the final dough quality wasn't as I would have liked. End bread was a little flat & too much moisture
The machine mix harvested a premium dough that was ready for the oven by the time the previous 2 were ready for baking.

Baking - gas oven, baked @ top of oven, 170 C (abt 335 F) for an hour then fan on for 10 minutes.  I removed the loaves from the tins (on the hour) and pplaced them directly onto my baking stones to force out some remaining moisture.  Silver tins used. Would black tins get any hotter?

The loaves brown beautifully, but retain too much moisture, even the machine mixture and I don't know why, very sad.

You might ask about the cracked window, well I'll tell you.  After finishing the hand mixing I floured my benchtop, and put my dough onto it and placing the mixing bowl away from my immediate work area to hold extra flour. "Right you mongrel", I said to the dough then startyed the kneading.  Well, The dough took off across the floured surface, collected the mixing bowl along with the salt container, water container, flour bag - the lot. The flour bag was instantly airborne and you guessed it, upside down and flour everywhere, the salt went straight for the sink & collected a glass or 2 on the way, whilst the mixing bowl skimmed straight along the bench and CRASH, straight into the window. Now there is a nice crack in it that will smile at me until I fix it next week (maybe).

Bread making is dangerous stuff.

Anyway, my questions are relating to retained moisture.  I weighed each wet dough and completed product and all were within 5 grams of each other.  Bit over 500 gms each wet and 450 gms baked.  I would have expected to have released more than 50mls (grams) of water during the baking process. I'm lost.

I hope you all (y'oll) can understand Strine (Australian language).

Any thoughts?

Brooksy


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## jasonr (Sep 17, 2004)

Why don't you explain exactly what you did, from start to finish, and how you went about doing it? It's hard to determine what went wrong without this information.


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## subfuscpersona (Sep 17, 2004)

*hand mixing woes - observations, questions, etc*

_For those of us who do not use metric system and measure both liquids and solids by volume, here is the recipie annotated with conversions. [1 oz = 28.35 gr by weight; 1 oz = 29.57 ml by volume]. A big thanks to Google calculator but check my math._



> The recipe used was a standard white loaf:
> 
> 300gms flour [10.6 oz by weight / about 2 US cups by volume]
> 180ml water [0.761 US cups]
> ...



Now to the problems:


> my questions are relating to retained moisture...The loaves brown beautifully, but retain too much moisture, even the machine mixture and I don't know why


You have 200 ml total liquid (about .85 cups) which gives you a liquid to solid ratio by volume of approximately 1:2.4 [e.g. 1 part liquid to 2.4 parts flour]. This is about what I use in my standard loaf bread recipie which yeilds *2* - 1 lb loaves. However, ratios don't necessarily scale down (or up) and your recipie is for *1* 1 lb loaf so (for mixer/hand methods) maybe your ratio should have been more around 1:3. I have _no experience with bread machines_ but I suspect that ideal ratios are different.

Some more observations:
> mixing/kneading method - the dough declined in quality as you went from bread machine to mixer to hand so it seems to me that you didn't knead long enough by mixer, much less entirely by hand.
> you baked in tins so obviously the only place steam can escape is at the top. (You don't mention whether you slashed the top of the bread before putting in the oven.) Your temp of 335F seems a little low to me (I usually bake at 375F or at least 350F). And yes, dark metal (or pyrex) pans would absorb heat more quickly (shiny silver reflects heat back). However,  it sounds as though the dough was too moist to start with. 

I find your description about all hand-kneading confusing. You say the dough was 





> hard as a rock


 which suggests to me that too much additional flour (beyond the amount in the recipie) was kneaded in and yet your main complaint is that the dough was too moist  :?:  :!: 

Give us more info on your equipment:
> oven - regular or convection? ("fan on" makes me wonder if it is convection or some kind of hybrid oven???)
> mixer - regular or heavy duty? If heavy duty, uses dough hook or spiral hook for kneading? If regular, stand or hand mixer?

Lastly, I second jasonr's reply - it's hard to know exactly how you went about this experiment. 

Keep in touch and good luck making bread!


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## Bangbang (Sep 17, 2004)

LMAO  Don't give up and having your wife there is bad Karma. Do the messy part when she is not home. Thats what I do.


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## Alix (Sep 17, 2004)

OK Brooksy, I am still giggling. You have a wonderful way of describing what you did. 

I am not sure where you went wrong, but it sounds like a too much flour, not enough kneading issue. The moisture thing I have no clue on. I am not nearly as technical as the boys on here, but I will share with you my bread recipe. 

3 cups flour 
10 oz milk 
1 1/2 tbsp sugar
1 1/2 tsp salt
2 (or 3) tbsp oil 
1 1/2 tsp fast rise yeast or 2 tsp regular stuff

I have found this recipe foolproof both in the machine and by hand. When you mix by hand you need to remember that you must knead long enough to break up all the gluten. (Think that is the right term) So when mixing it all by hand use the last 1/2 cup of flour to flour your board, don't actually put it into the mixture. This is a beautiful soft loaf of bread and I think the milk works better than the water. Good luck to you. This one as I said is foolproof (and I am the fool that proved it!)


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## Brooksy (Sep 18, 2004)

Last first & I work backwards.

Thanx for the giggle Alix, much appreciated.  Thanx for the recipe also I'll give it a try - best I can.  

My darking wife ALWAYS walks into the mess.  I know when she is about to arrive home - the mess is at it's worst.

Unfortunately conversions never work for me either imp - metric - imp.  I'm still caught in pounds, shillings & pence, and that changed in 1966.  

Sub - good work on the conversion. From what I have read elsewhere (now I've come to the best), a soft white mixture should be about .67 (2/3) liquid/flour for tin loaves and .6 (3/5) for free form (or 10% less water)such is the 200/300 ratio in my recipe. A 3/5 would be 180mls of liquid. I have only seen the ratio, or Baker's Percentage referred to in metric terms and not in imperial or US terms so I can't say. About the only thing I know for sure is that 1ml of water weighs 1gm.  

Prior to commencing my experiments I measured out all my ingedients into separate containers, checked them against each other & weighed the again before use.

I mixed the hand mixed dough by the bowl method - liquid, oil, sugar and yeast into the bowl first, then flour added slowly whilst mixing in a swirling action ensuring that then first half of the flour is smoothly incorporated.  The balance is added as before but it got horribly stiff& the fun started. And I'm not going to tell where the dough ended up after richoceting all over the work bench.

My hybrid system was to initially mix the dough in my mixer until completely mixed, rested it, and kneaded it several time in the mixer pausing between spurts. My initial mixing  used the 'bowl method', water in the mixing bowl turned the machine on and added the flour over about 5 or 6 minutes. After about a total of (less than) 10 mins I removed the dough to the kneading bench and gave it a workout for about  minutes by palm and rolling.

With the bread maker I just threw everything in (liquid 1st) let it go on a dough setting and pulled it out 90 minutes later - knocked it down, divided it (for hi top) rolled it and wacked it in the tin. No hassles.

Compared to the doughs later 2 doughs the handmixed was as hard as a rock and I intend to wait until I can get my darling wife to visit her mother 2.5 hrs drive away before I try hand mixing again (but she'll find out).

The end product appeared too moist not the dough. I did another bake yesterday with the bread maker and got comparable results but I set the oven at about 350F (175 C), removed the loaf from the pan and replaced it with fan on for 10 minutes. If I can produce that sort of quality consistently I'd be chuffed, but.......

Gas oven with switchable convection fan. Bread placed as high in the oven as possible. Have baking stones as well - preheated before bread put on top. Thought these would maintain heat at the base rather than a rack.

Mixer is only lightweight with counterrotating spirals & hook. Never again, not worth it.

Whew, How did I do?

Brooksy

P.S. Thanks to all, sorry about the spelling..........


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## kyles (Sep 18, 2004)

Strewth cobber dunno what these galahs made of all that. I just wished you'd vidoed it! Sounds hilarious.

I grew up baking by hand, so I guess it's an acquired art that I take for granted. Never take my advice again!!!

You made me homesick listening to that outburst!


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## jasonr (Sep 18, 2004)

Wow Brooksy. I hope it wasn't as complicated a procedure as it sounded! I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but this was just a standard white loaf, right? Now I'm a perfectionist too, and I'm the first person to check every single detail when baking, but even I think you might possibly be overthinking this thing. For example, why would you be concerned about moisture ratios in a pre-existing recipe? Isn't the point of using someone else's recipe that they have already measured and balanced these factors? It sounds to me like you are trying a mish-mash of different techniques to deal with your dough. Did your recipe recommend all of this stuff? Certainly, a little hand kneading towards the end is useful with machine kneaded dough to achieve the right consistency, and I could see the value of a little machine-kneading for a hand-kneaded loaf to achieve a more consistent texture, but what you're doing sounds way too complicated for plain white bread. 

In my opinion, you should follow your recipe to the letter, with as little variation as possible. Improvisation is the enemy of good baking, in my experience; why do it differently when someone more experienced and knowledgeable than you (the person who wrote the recipe) has done it better already?


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## mudbug (Sep 18, 2004)

G'day Brooksy:

I'm no expert bread maker, but one thing that seemed to be missing from your strenuous workout was letting the dough simply rest between bouts of wrestling.  A little benign neglect might be just the thing.  Let 'er rise a bit before beating back into submission.

Haven't a clue about the moisture and temperature and science and all that.  

No worries, then.  Please send Eric Thorpe to me straight away.


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## Brooksy (Sep 19, 2004)

Thanks Kyles, but I think the only Galah is the one trying to make bread.

Jasonr: Really the only complicated parts are my explanations.   Just simple bread, bit o' flour, water, sugar, oil, yeast the usual stuff.  I really want everything to be the same in all breads, fastidious - maybe, but it beat the question of did I put more water etc in any of the mixes. I can definitely say they were the same - within the error of my measuring equipment anyway. The recipe is very good and I can taste the different oils, but until I am convinced I'm doing it right, then I'll keep trying.  I realise moisture content in the finished product is essential to retain freshness, but I still think there is something wrong with something. :? 

Mudbag: I'll bite, where did you get the handle mudbag from?  You're prolly right. I could be too busy trying to beat the stuffing out of my dough instead of beating the stuffing into it.

At the end of the day, I can do all my mixing by B/Maker and oven bake, but if asked to make some bread at a BBQ, what do I say' "Sorry, haven't got my bread maker with me"   How embarassing.  A bit like horses really, I was taught "If yer can't shoe 'em, don't ride'em." Really determined to succeed.

As a bit of an aside, I went up to the airstrip yesterday for a break & took our 14mth old Pomeranian X Jack Russel (PJ). After he'd been belting around for a while he decided it was time for a nap so up onto my knee he came. He immediately assumed the 'baby position', exposing all his God given gifts to the World and I continued reading. Madisson, a 5 yo daughter of a good friend of mine came up and pointed to PJ's jewels, "What are these? she asked.

Without thinking I answered "Nuts."
"Nuts?"
Uh oh I'm in strife here.
"Er, yes. Spacer nuts."
"What are they for?"
"To keep his back legs apart"
"Sascha hasn't got spacer nuts." she said looking at me as if I was pulling her leg.
"Sascha is a big Labrador and her legs are wide enough apart so she doesn't need them" Whew, I wish she go away.
"And what's this?" she enquired pointing to the other part.
"That there is the adjusting screw in case his legs need to be made wider or narrower"
"Oh. Ok. Can we adjust them now?"
"No, he is trying to sleep."
"Oh. Ok. I'll go and tell Mummy we gunna adjust them later." With that she was off like a shot.

10 minutes late Mum comes over..............

All of your info is great and I cannot thank you all enough.  Good value.


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## Brooksy (Sep 19, 2004)

Sorry about doubling up, but I just read the last line of Mudbag's reply.

Eric Thorpe eh. What has an Aircraft Mechanical Engineer got to do with baking bread?  He works on our plane (little plane)?

You better enlighten me on this one.  Where are you?
Got the lingo right.

Brooksy


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## mudbug (Sep 19, 2004)

Brooksy said:
			
		

> Sorry about doubling up, but I just read the last line of Mudbag's reply.
> 
> Eric Thorpe eh. What has an Aircraft Mechanical Engineer got to do with baking bread?  He works on our plane (little plane)?
> 
> ...



Still laughing about the little one's lesson in anatomy.  To answer your questions: 

Mudbug is another name for crawfish, usually heard in Louisiana.   The people on my dad's side originate from that part of the world.  I have a great affection for Cajun food and music, and chose to honor that part of my heritage with an appropriate moniker.

There's *another* Eric Thorpe?!  The one that should be mailed is the lad from Oz who beat the other lads in some of the swimming events in the recent Olympics.  Made my teeth hurt just to look at 'im.  

Actually, I'm a respectable matron living way outside the Beltway (Washington, DC).  I'm learning the lingo from my Ozzie sister-in-law (Perth).

How's that bread goin', then?


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## kyles (Sep 19, 2004)

That's Ian Thorpe......the lad with the impossibly big feet!


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## mudbug (Sep 19, 2004)

kyles said:
			
		

> That's Ian Thorpe......the lad with the impossibly big feet!



Big ooops. Right you are, Kyles.  Guess I was just too busy looking.........


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## kyles (Sep 19, 2004)

Lol.......as you do, he is pretty cute. I prefer Michael Klim though, he's lovely!!!!


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## mudbug (Sep 19, 2004)

Will have to look Michael up.  

Funnily enough, I was just thinking of you and wondering if you have ever posted any recipes from Old Blighty, such as bubble and squeak, toad in the hole, or spotted dick?


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## Alix (Sep 19, 2004)

I think I hurt myself reading this thread. God help us all if you three (Brooksy, kyles, and mudbug...or mudbag) ever decide to get together! If you do, please invite me, please please, I haven't laughed this hard for quite some time. My kids are asking what I am doing...and believe me, I DID NOT wish to repeat Brooksy's anatomy lesson for my girls. LOL!!!!


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## oldcoot (Sep 19, 2004)

Brooksy, somewhere I read tha, concerning bread dough, "Wetter is better".

Most recipes recomment adding flour until the dough is the desired consistency - even though the recipe calls for a specific amount of  flour.

When using a loaf pan, I make a very soft dough, just barely past the sticky stage. 

I put only the thinnest layer of flour on my kneading surface - just enough to avoid sticking.  A soft dough kneads easily, but you must knead it long enough to get that smooth "baby's butt" consistency. 

As for exceseive moisture in the final product, my guess is that you simply didn't let it bake long enough.  Obviously, a lower baking temperature requires a longer time.  I find a 1 1/4 lb loaf reuires about 35 minutes at 335F, else it seems a bit "doughy"/


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## mudbug (Sep 19, 2004)

Alix said:
			
		

> I think I hurt myself reading this thread. God help us all if you three (Brooksy, kyles, and mudbug...or mudbag) ever decide to get together! If you do, please invite me, please please, I haven't laughed this hard for quite some time. My kids are asking what I am doing...and believe me, I DID NOT wish to repeat Brooksy's anatomy lesson for my girls. LOL!!!!



That would be fun - participants from Canada, England, Oz, and the States - four countries separated by a common language.


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## Alix (Sep 19, 2004)

Now THAT would be a party! I vote we each bring a dish and a drink native or popular in our particular country and have a BIG party. Who's in?


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## subfuscpersona (Sep 19, 2004)

*Broosky's bread made by hand*

hi Broosky - it's me again -

hey - I just noticed this in your earlier post...


> With the bread maker I just threw everything in (liquid 1st) let it go on a dough setting and pulled it out _*90 minutes*_ later - knocked it down, divided it (for hi top) rolled it and wacked it in the tin.


wow! 90 minutes kneading for a l-lb loaf seems awfully long to me - is this normal for using a bread machine? 

Also, for any of your test batches, after the dough was kneaded did you ever give it a rise in the bowl before letting it rise in the pan?

Anyway, I decided to make your recipie entirely by hand.  I used a small battery-powered kitchen scale to weigh ingredients (scale doesn't include weight of container if you put the container on the scale before turning it on). BTW, you said your...





> Flour constituents were:
> 2 Tbspn Gluten Flour (80% protein)
> 1 tspn Bread Improver (95% soya flour etc)
> Topped up with AP Flour


I had neither soy or gluten flour in the house so I left out the soy and substituted half AP and half bread flour. Here's your recipie again with what I used in italics.





> 300gms flour [10.6 oz by weight / about 2 US cups by volume] _150 gm unbleached AP and 150 gm white bread flour_
> 180ml water [0.761 US cups]
> 20 mls oil (Macadamia) [4.059 tsp-US or 1.353 TBS-US]  _4 tsp corn oil_
> 1.5 tspn salt
> ...



and here are my notes...

prep > Take yeast out of freezer. Put 150gm by weight AP and BR flour in seperate bowls and measure out dry ingredients. Put 180gm water (1 ml = 1 grm right?) in measuring cup (actually looked closer to 200 ml). Get out bowl and sturdy wire whip.

proof yeast > put about 1/4 cup of the water, 2 pinches of the sugar and all of yeast in bowl - give it a good stir and let sit for about 5 min to proof.

make sponge > stir *all of the bread flour* into bowl and beat/stir by hand for about 5 min - this is actual time (can't include time spent resting my weary hand). Ok - I have errands to run so I'll just leave bowl uncovered on the counter and check it in about an hour. Should have about doubled in bulk by that time.

add remaining ingredients > Hmmm, took longer than I expected for errands (maybe 90 min?) but I made a detour to buy an oven thermometer. Sponge has definitely doubled and kitchen has a pleasant yeasty smell. Stir in rest of sugar, salt, oil. Start stirring in AP flour in small batches. Oops, should have switched to a spoon cuz batter is glomming up inside the whip. Pry out dough; looks like I've added about 1/2 of the AP flour. Time to knead...

kneading > Should start by noting that *all flour is coming from the bowl of 150 gm AP flour* (not using any extra). Sprinkle a small handful of the AP flour on table, dump dough on top of flour, flour hands . Dough is really sticky and moist at this point so must knead gently. Each time dough starts to stick to my hands, I take a small amount of flour and rub it through my hands letting the rest fall on top of the dough. By the time I've kneaded in 2/3 of the AP flour the dough is taking shape and isn't as sticky. Keep adding a small handful of flour at a time, kneading it after each addition until dough starts to stick to the table at which point I add more flour and resume kneading. After about 7 min all flour well incorporated and dough has a nice "hand" - light, smooth and resilient. Could stop now but decide to knead a little longer (didn't use any more flour!) for a *total kneading time of 10 min*.

rise in bowl > lightly oil bowl, dump in dough, turn in circle and flip so top is oiled. Normally I  cover the top of the dough with platic wrap but, since the dough is a little moister than I'm used to, decide simply to cover bowl with a towel. Set timer for 1 hour. In the interest of scientific accuracy I check the local temperature - http://weather.gov/ tells me its in the low 70's and the humidity is 54%. (This is fun! - I feel like I'm back in a 6th grade science class.)

shape dough and rise in pan > One hour was just right - dough has doubled in bulk and weighs 500 gm. Sprinkle a tiny amount of flour on board, knead about 4-5 turns (notice dough is not as moist as it was before the rise), form into ball, cover with towel and let rest for about 15 min while I grease my pan and tidy up the kitchen. Shape into loaf and put in pan. Hmmm, dough looks a little lonely in there - is pan too big??? Dig around for a smaller pan - find a metal one measuring 7.5" x 4" x 2" deep (capacity 3 cups) - grease pan and in goes the dough - definitely a better size. Check dough after 30 min. Nicely risen. Score top of dough, start oven preheating to 350F. Temp reached after about 10 minutes. On to ...

baking > Set bread pan on rack in middle of oven. Not sure how long to bake so will check progress in 30 min. 
...30 min later - bread definitely continued to rise in the oven (looks like maybe an additional inch?) and is just starting to color slightly. Will check again in 10-15 min...
...15 min later - crust hasn't browned much more (the crust of my white bread is usually darker after 45 min baking). Will mimic broosky's aproach by removing bread from pan and setting directly on rack - I'll kick up the heat to 375F too...
...15 min later - bread is a light golden tan - I don't want to over-bake so out it comes to cool on a rack. Finished product is about 4" high and weighs 425gm.

Gotta go meet a friend so will post this now (hope it's not too long). Cheers to all - SP


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## mudbug (Sep 19, 2004)

Alix said:
			
		

> Now THAT would be a party! I vote we each bring a dish and a drink native or popular in our particular country and have a BIG party. Who's in?



Well, me and my big mouth of course.  To those of you in the (former?)Coomonwealth - what Amerikansky thing have you always wanted to try?
If I don't know how to make it, I will try to find the recipe.  One rule:  there will be no McFood.

Note to Alix - we should probably be doing this on the Dine With Us thread, but I love the randomness of how things get talked about/acted upon of this whole board.


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## Brooksy (Sep 20, 2004)

SAITE - Slinks Away In Total Embarassment   

Mudbug my most humble and sincere apologies over my misreading of your name.

I told Eric he had fans in America & around the world and he said (fairdinkum) "What, for fixing planes? What are you smoking Brooksy?"

Yes Thorpey (Thorpedo) and klimmy (Boofhead) are really nice people in person too.  Don't know whether I should say they are good looking - I have a wife & kids. We're all related down here, nuthin' else to do.

G'day Oldcoot.  Nice to meet you, I been reading your posts and going absolutely ape____ over your pics.  Beautiful looking results - very very impressed, and somewhat jealous.  I tried a plait after seeing yours, and boy oh boy, what a flop.  Rose beautifully and I reckon I left it too long & it ended up a split plait.    Been 20 years since I've paddled a baby's butt. It is really hard explaining that exact texture

Our native drink is Beer, a good liquid for bread. Unfortunately not a Bud man myself, I find it a bit tasteless.  If you've got any maltier beers over there wack some in your bread instead of water/milk. Our wines aren't bad either but I'm not putting that in bread.

As long as we keep mentioning bread then we're ok.

What American Dish would I like to try? Spicy, hot, seafood or game prob southern because northern North Americans & Canadians (generalizing for debate purposes) are pretty much like us - meat & 3 veg  :P 

I can produce bewdiful pasta dinky di homemade pasta, but fail in the bread department. Not even game to try pastry at all.   

Speaking of which, I just got another loaf of 'The Old Dodger" in the oven as we type. Been in an hour @ 170C & still stuck to the pan - a worry. Pumped up the temp & give it another 10mins to see if it releases.  Dust my pans rather than oil.

The other day when Miss 5yo's mother came over I was sure what she was going to say because they questioned Maddy intensely over ther spacer nuts.  She was crippled. Maddy related the whole story to them on the reason some dogs have spacer nuts and some don't.  Do dogs have spacer nuts in US?

Mudbug I've never posted a message anywhere else except here & I've computer wise since '77 & Internet since '94.  I married a Pom and I dare say most of you will know what a 'Ten Pound Import" is.  Well I caught me one.  Sue & her family came out here as free settlers back '66.  I told some lies and ended up with a fully imported model - better than the domestic breeds.   Yep know my bubbles from my pudds & toads. Susie was taught well by my mother outlaw.

My Mum was actually born in California, dunno whether you've ever heard of the place, in a little town of San Jose. They came over here in about '21 or '22.


Any way time for a bread report - bugger, got carried away typing on this thing & forgot all about it! Dark, dark brown.  At least it won't be overly moist in the middle this time.

Better post this & go and sample this bread. If it is crook, I ain't tellin'


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## Brooksy (Sep 20, 2004)

Turned out Krusty, 10 mins earlier would have been perfect.

I did however stray from my standard white recipe and replaced water with milk and sugar with honey, same amounts. Can really taste the honey, very nice.

C y'll later,

Brooksy


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## Brooksy (Sep 20, 2004)

subfuscpersona, I hope you type fast.

Sounds like you had success Great stuff.

One thing though, the 90 minute cycle is 30 mins mixing & kneading and 60 mins rise. Sorry.

If you have a digcam can you post a picture? Love to see it an compare.  Unfortunately I don't own a digital cam any more.  Thieves needed it more & I haven't replaced it.

Brooksy


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## mudbug (Sep 20, 2004)

Brooksy:

No worries over the name.  Some would probably say yours is mo' bettah.
We were meant to "meet" - my mum is also a native (southern) Californian and dad started his working life as an aircraft mechanic. He grew up in New Orleans so I can for sure give you some ideas on spicy seafood tucker.  Tell your Eric hello anyway and sorry for the mixup.

Didn't quite get all the strine in your last post, but haven't talked to my Ozzie SIL in a bit.  We had a Pom in the family but he didn't work out so my sis had to let him go.  That's life.

As for Oz food, something with prawns would be nice.  But no Vegamite, please.  

Alix: got any recipes for polar bear?


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## Alix (Sep 20, 2004)

Nope, no polar bear, but I did have one for whale blubber...heeheehee. I think I will get myself over to the Dine with us section to post some stuff too.

As for me, well, I would like to try Southern food. I have been reading some of the posts by Raine and the rest and it sounds yummy. I am thinking chicken fried steak with red eye gravy would be a good starting point.

As for Oz food, well...hmmm...I agree with the no Vegemite stuff, but otherwise, I am good to try most anything. What is a good start Brooksy, kyles?


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## mudbug (Sep 20, 2004)

Rainee has posted some excellent southern-style recipes.  Maybe it's just me, but I would never eat redeye gravy on chicken fried steak.  Redeye is for ham only, in my book.  Chicken-fried steak calls for a thick white gravy.


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## Brooksy (Sep 20, 2004)

I'm posting on Dine with us on the diversion subject - Vegemite good Aussie Tucker.

C U there,

Brooksy


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## subfuscpersona (Sep 21, 2004)

Brooksy said:
			
		

> If you have a digcam can you post a picture? Love to see it an compare.


I found the digital camera but I've lost the cable that lets me upload to the 'puter so I'll have to pick up another one. Will post picture if I can keep the loaf from being eaten before it has it's photo session. Check back in about 2 days if you're still interested.


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## subfuscpersona (Sep 21, 2004)

*pix of Broosky bread recipie kneaded by hand*



			
				Brooksy said:
			
		

> If you have a digcam can you post a picture? Love to see it an compare.


here are the pix














[/i]


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## Brooksy (Sep 21, 2004)

Dear oh dear,

  I am now officially jealous. It is a pity there isn't a little green smiley.  

That looks terrific! I hope it tasted as good as it looked

WELL DONE

Now I know what to work at.

Brooksy


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## Brooksy (Sep 21, 2004)

I wasn't going to say anything, but I'd better own up.

Another failure. Before viewing sub's pics I made another batch, a double batch for 1kg of dough (pound loaf recipe doubled) to make 2 pound loaves (obviously). I did this to freeze 1 & cook one to see if it does work.

I made only small mod, water should have been 360mls, I used 350mls. 360mls water + 40mls oil would retain the .67 ratio but reducing the water by 10ml gives a ratio  .65 . Dough looked & felt beaut, came together well in the bowl, first rise was slow at about 1.5 hrs, second rise was very slow at 2 hrs.

Baked at 190C (375F) @ 45mins looked good, sounded solid, removed @ 1hr and was dry   

All ingredients well within life, I'll back off the temp 10 deg & see what happens with second loaf now on rise. :? 

Brooksy


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