# Italian sandwich roll recipe needed



## ewilson04341

i am originally from maine and want to make the the italian roll from scratch because i so miss the original italian sandwich from maine
Can someone out there help me with this?????


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## PieSusan

JoeV has recipes on the bread page and pictures and videos.


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## quicksilver

Go to the bread catagory and look for JoeV's thread dated 12/01/08, called "Italian Sub Sandwich Bread". Pics are included, and mouth watering!


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## PieSusan

Here ya go: 
http://www.discusscooking.com/forums/f23/italian-sub-sandwich-bread-52702.html


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## quicksilver

ewilson04341 said:


> i am originally from maine and want to make the the italian roll from scratch because i so miss the original italian sandwich from maine
> Can someone out there help me with this?????


 
ewilson, did you look at JoeV's recipe & picks? How did you make out?


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## ewilson04341

yeah i looked at it and printed and read it through but this calls for a crusty bread this bread i am talking about is not crusty its actually a soft bread sort of like a hot dog roll but yet again a hot dog roll is not the right consistency i am looking for. Call me Picky its about the bread with this sandwich.


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## JoeV

ewilson04341 said:


> yeah i looked at it and printed and read it through but this calls for a crusty bread this bread i am talking about is not crusty its actually a soft bread sort of like a hot dog roll but yet again a hot dog roll is not the right consistency i am looking for. Call me Picky its about the bread with this sandwich.



Dear Picky,

If you want a soft crust do not put any type of glaze on the bread. Just bake it, them when the bread comes out of the oven, rub a stick of butter on the top and cover with a tea towel. this will hold the moisture in the top crust and soften it nicely. 

A soft crust is not really a quality of Italian bread, a chewy crust is its signature with a soft, airy crumb. If you want very nice sandwich rolls with soft crust, try my Basic White Bread recipe. It has sugar, milk and butter in the dough, and you can shape the dough to any shape you desire. I make this recipe for our sandwich/hamburger rolls every 7-10 days. they are delicious and they freeze well. Yes, I have made them in the shape of hogie rolls (tubes), using 4 oz of dough per roll. For very soft crust, eliminate the egg wash.

Enjoy!

Joe


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## jonnyroyal

*I too need a good Italian Sandwich Roll Recipe*

I know how You feel!!! Ilived in southern Maine for 49 years. I spent 15 years working in Boston, NYC, and Philly. I know live in Northeastern Nevada and have not been able to find anything that comes close to an Italian Sandwich. I have made friends with a local Baker and have been trying to explain to her what a REAL Italian Sandwich looks like. My next step is to have one sent overnight on FEDEX so We can disect it. So if you have any luck I would love to hear about it.


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## mabrodis

Did any of you try that roll recipe?  As a kid I went to Maine for vacations and loved Amato's sandwiches, still do, everytime we are back there we eat literately dozens of them.

I have tried to recreate the sandwich roll many times and have had zero success.  All the recipes I have tried end up being more like traditional Italian bread (thin/thick crust, dry airy inside), which could not be more different from Amato's bread.  Amato's is dense, almost undercooked, not even a hint of a crust on it.

When in Maine last year I bought some of the bread just to eat it plain, thinking I could figure it out.  The bread basically tasted like a hotdog bun, though less sweet, denser and if eating by itself you would say it needed more salt.  

The frustrating part is most recipes for hotdog buns are basically white bread recipes also...so, still trying...the recipe could be something simple and just the procedure is unique, if we only had a insider at the Amato's bakery.... 

I suspect the bread is baked in a low oven, since they have no browning at all.

-Mark


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## Inancook

*Italian "Sandwich" roll*

For those of your searching for the Maine Italian "Sandwich" roll, here's what I have come up with.

Although, I'm still searching and haven't really tried a recipe yet, I am from Maine and I know exactly what you are looking for.  I've been thinking lately that the consistency of the Italian sandwich roll is much like the Yeast Dinner Roll.  I'm thinking we could make the roll and rather than make balls for the dinner roll, maybe make long ropes.  What people have to understand is that they must bake next to each other so they become attached, not separately like other sub rolls.  

These are really nothing like an "Italian roll", but have a very soft crust like on the top of a split hot dog roll.  They are called Italian sandwich rolls because of the "sandwich" not the roll.  They were originally made for Italian workers in Maine by an Italian baker and they evolved into the "Italian Sandwich" most all Mainers love and crave.  

I think the very soft crust is made by some sort of dough enhancer or another bakers trick, not necessarily by brushing with butter or a towel but I'm not sure.  They are unlike any other rolls I have come across EXCEPT the dinner roll, which comes very close.  I am including a link for the dinner rolls so you can see what the consistency looks like, just imagine them in long rolls rather than dinner roll size, (same height though) but about 11 or 12 inches long.  
http://www.recipebridge.com/g/ODI1NzYyMzo6OjoxMTA=

It is the crust that might come out differently but I think this type of roll is the basis and we just have to find out how they get that crust consistency although this crust in this recipe looks very close.  Happy hunting.


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## dhardt

I used to work at Nappi's Bakery in Portland Maine.
The quintessential Italian Sandwich Bread bakery in the southern Maine area.

The trick to the crust is to spray it with water before the proofing and after the proofing. The water for moistening and the water used in the dough was very well filtered also.
(note: after the proofing the dough ropes should be touching each other to the point of rising upward (not outward.)

A full size bakers sheet should hold 15 ropes (I think. It has been 20+ years) They were bagged in 6's and the division per pan was not even.

As to the recipe, it was a family secret.

There is no other bread like that in the world.


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## Kathleen

dhardt said:


> I used to work at Nappi's Bakery in Portland Maine.
> The quintessential Italian Sandwich Bread bakery in the southern Maine area.
> 
> The trick to the crust is to spray it with water before the proofing and after the proofing. The water for moistening and the water used in the dough was very well filtered also.
> (note: after the proofing the dough ropes should be touching each other to the point of rising upward (not outward.)
> 
> A full size bakers sheet should hold 15 ropes (I think. It has been 20+ years) They were bagged in 6's and the division per pan was not even.
> 
> As to the recipe, it was a family secret.
> 
> There is no other bread like that in the world.




Thanks for sharing and welcome to DC!


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## kate100

Hi! I signed up specifically for this thread but I now realize there are many other interesting things to explore here. I realize this is an old thread but I'd like to bring it back to life. I too once lived in Maine and I CRAVE Maine Italian sandwiches and am trying to figure out what the Maine Italian Sandwich Bread Recipe might be? . I'm trying to see if I can make them at home and wonder if anyone has anymore tips or tricks to offer? I've tried hamburger and hot dog roll recipes and they aren't the same. Thanks!


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## Kathleen

Welcome to DC, Kate!

I found a thread here that discusses your rolls.  I keep trying to get my favorite bread maker to try different things.  Hopefully, you will find the rolls you seek.


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## Margi Cintrano

Buon Giorno, 

Interesting Post ... 

*** Involtini ( Rolls ) in Roma ... 

When we were in Roma, we had enjoyed Turkey Involtini stuffed with fresh home made Ricotta with black truffles at Casa Bleve on Vìa Del Teatro Valle Number 49 ... 

In Italia, I have never seen Involtini in bread ... They are a roll served without bread. 

Therefore, I would tend to believe that this Recipe from Maine had been developed by Italian Immigrants either during the 1920s or WWII 40s or prior to 1920s ... 

Any historical knowledge on topic ?

Good luck with finding the right recipe for you.

Have a nice Sunday. 
Ciao, Margi. Cintrano.


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## justplainbill

I prefer Italian breads and rolls that look like this-
(Of course the small rolls are often round and of a much lighter color.)


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## Margi Cintrano

Bill,

Me too !

Crisy exteriors ... And the seeds ... 

Ciao,
Margi.


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## kate100

*Hi! THANKS!*

Hi Kathleen!
WOW! Thanks! I don't know how I've missed that one! I'll disect that thread, try the tips sometime over the next few days and report back! 

Hi Margi!
I think we've met on Foods of the World forum! 
History:
You're correct!
1902 Giovanni Amato began making this bread and selling it to shipworkers. He brought the recipe from Italy.

It has a different texture than the breads we in the US consider to be "Italian" in that it has a fine crumb and isn't crusty.

When considering the origin of this bread and the fact that one small bakery in Maine produces 10,000 Italian sandwich rolls per day, it has to be a fairly simple secret and I have to remember to not over think this! I think there are 3 bakeries in Maine producing these rolls. Amatos, Bottos and Nappis.

Let the experimentation begin! 

Thanks again to you both! kate


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## justplainbill

In my travels from Milano and Vicenza to Roma the Subway / Blimpie  (swollen frankfurter roll / hamburger bun / Wonderbread consistency) breads did not seem to be particularly popular; except perhaps with people who have dental problems.  Many of the northern Italian breads seemed to be a little short in the salt department.  Throughout much of Europe breads of a more substantial nature seemed to be favored more than many of the breads favored in the USA.
I had to learn how to bake my own bread bread my when I moved out of the NYC area.


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## kate100

I'm a bread fiend.......and also a bread snob! lol! I've been baking so long the Home Ec. teacher in high school had me, as a 7th grader, come in to teach the seniors how to make bread! lol! I completely understand your need to learn to make bread!
Those are beautiful loaves justplainbill.


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## kadesma

kate100 said:


> I'm a bread fiend.......and also a bread snob! lol! I've been baking so long the Home Ec. teacher in high school had me, as a 7th grader, come in to teach the seniors how to make bread! lol! I completely understand your need to learn to make bread!
> Those are beautiful loaves justplainbill.


You might try looking here  we love ciabatta.
Ciabatta Rolls: King Arthur Flour

kades


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## bakechef

I know the flavor and texture of this bread having grown up in Maine, but honestly I've never had any like them anywhere else, and I am not quite sure how they are made.  There is a place back home that produces kaiser (also called hard or bulkie rolls up there) and deliver them to grocery stores, I always buy them to make sandwiches, they are so good, I wish that I knew how to make them.  

I'm willing to bet that there is some potato starch in them, potato starch makes bread so soft and velvety in texture.


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## versionist

Being a Maine Italian sandwich fiend, there are two undisputed atrocities in many parts of the country:

1.)  The rarity of sour pickles
2.)  The rarity of usable Italian sandwich bread

Now, I am from the NY/NJ area, and I know what people mean about "Italian" sandwiches around hear, and I understand why some will give an askew look towards the Italian I know and love.  They will never understand that you have to have the pickles and the bread has to be just right!

The bread:  Akin to the hot dog roll, but a bit more dense, and certainly bigger.  No, it's not crusty, and no it doesn't have seeds. 

Having said that, I do not bake, but I can search well.  And yes, I have found some brands of supermarket bread that fit the bill!  They are both nice and soft, with only the color of the crust (no toughness).  They are sold near the deli section of the supermarket, but sometimes are in the bread isle.  For the sake of a picture, see link of one of the brands below:

Azio & Sons Sub Rolls - Walmart.com: Anzio & Sons Rolls: 6 Ct Sub, 15 oz: Bakery & Bread

I can't for the life of me remember the other brands, but they all come in similar Italian color packaging, and you can tell just be giving a little squeeze that it is right.  I get them at both Pathmark and Shoprite in NJ.

I do make my own pickles now.  Whenever I find sour pickles, I buy them all and they are never restocked.


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## Inancook

Margi Cintrano said:


> Buon Giorno,
> 
> Interesting Post ...
> 
> *** Involtini ( Rolls ) in Roma ...
> 
> When we were in Roma, we had enjoyed Turkey Involtini stuffed with fresh home made Ricotta with black truffles at Casa Bleve on Vìa Del Teatro Valle Number 49 ...
> 
> In Italia, I have never seen Involtini in bread ... They are a roll served without bread.
> 
> Therefore, I would tend to believe that this Recipe from Maine had been developed by Italian Immigrants either during the 1920s or WWII 40s or prior to 1920s ...
> 
> Any historical knowledge on topic ?
> 
> Good luck with finding the right recipe for you.
> 
> Have a nice Sunday.
> Ciao, Margi. Cintrano.



You can view the history here:

Amato's - Pizza :: Pasta :: Sandwiches - Our History

And here:

Amato's - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Inancook

justplainbill said:


> I prefer Italian breads and rolls that look like this-
> (Of course the small rolls are often round and of a much lighter color.)



Please do not get us wrong jpb We tottaly agree with you there is nothing like a crusty chewy loaf of italian bread!!  We love that... too!!  It's just that for the sandwich we are trying to make the crusty bread would not work well.  It needs to be plyable and not hard to bite into.  I would say that the roll we are talking about, although it is called an "italian" roll (because the name of the sandwich is called "Italian Sandwich") it really is NOTHING like an italian loaf of bread NOR is the sandwich any thing like something "italian."  We know that is a conundrum but it's just the way it is.  It is a unique sandwich and a unique roll but I'm quite sure if you ever were to have one you would truly enjoy it.  Here are a couple of sites (which do not have the roll recipe) that show what the sandwich and roll look like. The first one is Amatos website and the other is from someone who worked at Amatos for years.  Also, in post #24 to Margi Cintrano, you will see I have posted a historical account of these sandwiches.  Enjoy!!  

Amato's - Pizza :: Pasta :: Sandwiches - Home 

AND

The Original Italian Sandwich Recipe | Just A Pinch Recipes


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## Inancook

versionist said:


> Being a Maine Italian sandwich fiend, there are two undisputed atrocities in many parts of the country:
> 
> 1.)  The rarity of sour pickles
> 2.)  The rarity of usable Italian sandwich bread



The oil is also a MUST for the sandwich... AND greek olives.  

I checked out the Amatos oil bottle and found that it is a BLEND of olive oil and other oils (I don't remember which).  So I experimented and found that Wesson Oil has an oil which is called Best Blend. It is a blend of canola and soybean oils.  I mix this with my cold pressed extra virgin olive oil, using a ratio of 1:1, and it's almost perfect.  

I live in Oklahoma and the Walmart here sells a large container of sour pickles which is acceptable but they have to be refrigerated after opening so you need room in the frige.  I can't find any of the pickles at the deli like I used to in Maine. 

I, also, haven't found the greek olives in the deli like in Maine but, once again, Walmart does sell Kalamata Olives in a jar, brand name Mezzeta, which are very good.  

All-in-all, they taste much like Amatos.  I'm still looking for a recipe for the roll but untill then I've found some that fit the bill.  I'll keep working on my search and will post back if I ever do... for those might be looking in the future.


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## Inancook

dhardt said:


> I used to work at Nappi's Bakery in Portland Maine.
> The quintessential Italian Sandwich Bread bakery in the southern Maine area.
> 
> The trick to the crust is to spray it with water before the proofing and after the proofing. The water for moistening and the water used in the dough was very well filtered also.
> (note: after the proofing the dough ropes should be touching each other to the point of rising upward (not outward.)
> 
> A full size bakers sheet should hold 15 ropes (I think. It has been 20+ years) They were bagged in 6's and the division per pan was not even.
> 
> As to the recipe, it was a family secret.
> 
> There is no other bread like that in the world.



Thank you dhardt.  This is very helpful!!


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## Fos87

justplainbill said:


> In my travels from Milano and Vicenza to Roma the Subway / Blimpie  (swollen frankfurter roll / hamburger bun / Wonderbread consistency) breads did not seem to be particularly popular; except perhaps with people who have dental problems.  Many of the northern Italian breads seemed to be a little short in the salt department.  Throughout much of Europe breads of a more substantial nature seemed to be favored more than many of the breads favored in the USA.
> I had to learn how to bake my own bread bread my when I moved out of the NYC area.


Bread is more popular in the south. My mother is from Sicily and sometimes she prepairs the "pane cunzato". It is hot bread just taken from the oven, with salt, pepper, oil (extra virgin oliva oil, of course). You can add dry pomatos, olives.


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## Cooking Goddess

bakechef said:


> I know the flavor and texture of this bread having grown up in Maine, but honestly I've never had any like them anywhere else, and I am not quite sure how they are made...


Since someone made this thread *ahem* rise to the top  I had to check it out. I've never lived in Maine and, when visiting, am sure I've never eaten a sandwich that didn't have lobster in it. But I had to soldier on and look for a copycat recipe for a bread I've never tasted. bakechef, your name says it all. I found a recipe that might be like the rolls you remember from Maine. If you want to check it out, you can find it here: Budget101.com - - Copycat Amato's Italian Sub Rolls | Italian Sandwiches | Homemade Italian Sub Rolls


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## Jeff2019

kate100 said:


> Hi! I signed up specifically for this thread but I now realize there are many other interesting things to explore here. I realize this is an old thread but I'd like to bring it back to life. I too once lived in Maine and I CRAVE Maine Italian sandwiches and am trying to figure out what the Maine Italian Sandwich Bread Recipe might be? . I'm trying to see if I can make them at home and wonder if anyone has anymore tips or tricks to offer? I've tried hamburger and hot dog roll recipes and they aren't the same. Thanks!



The light bread that is soft on the inside, but not chewy and has light layers along the sides. It's an extraordinary sandwich that compliments any filling crammed within it, but... if you venture out of New England chances are slim that you'll be able to enjoy the taste... until Now. 

To be fair, let me explain that in Maine we don't refer to them as subs, they're simply "Italians",


but as you head south towards Boston, New York and Jersey- they transform into "subs". 

Here's a copycat recipe for New England Italian rolls, fresh from a 'Maine-ah' who's moved south!

You'll Need:
2 cups water, lukewarm (about 110 degrees F)
4 tsp Bread Machine Yeast (fast rising)
3 1/2 cups bread flour
2 1/4 cup Cake Flour
1 tablespoon dark brown sugar
2 tablespoons extra-virgin olive oil
1 tablespoon salt 

Place the warm water and yeast in the bowl of an electric or stand mixer and allow the yeast to bloom for about 5 minutes (optional for some types of yeast). 

Using a dough hook attachment, add the flours and sugar to the water and mix 

low speed until a dough starts to form. 

Drizzle the oil and salt into the dough and beat on medium speed for 8 to 10 minutes (or knead the dough by hand), or until a smooth, firm, elastic dough is formed.


Transfer the dough to a lightly oiled bowl and spray the dough with a thin coating of cooking spray (cooking spray not necessary if you roll the dough around the oil-lined bowl). 

Wrap the bowl with plastic wrap and set aside to proof in a warm, draft-free place for 1 to 1 1/2 hours or until doubled in size.

Remove the plastic wrap, punch down and flatten the rounded dough with the heel of your hand. Roll the dough up tightly, sealing the seam well after each roll. Place the rolls with the sides touching slightly on a greased cookie sheet to rise again.


Allow the dough to proof, loosely covered with a damp towel for 30 minutes, or until doubled in size. 


oven to 325 degrees

Lightly spritz the dough with water from a water bottle and then place the rolls in the oven. Immediately close the oven and bake for 3 minutes. Open the oven door and spray the dough again with the water bottle. Bake for about 30-35 minutes 

Split the Italian roll (don't completely cut through, all your fillings fall out and that's not how we do it!) add sliced ham, sliced american cheese, diced onions, halved black olives, sliced dill pickles, sliced tomato, sliced green pepper, sprinkle with salt and pepper and drizzle lightly with olive oil.

Do not forget to wrap in wax paper after sandwich is made


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## RoseMart

Hi All! Want to update this thread. I've ALMOST got it!
I looked up Lucarelli's Bakery in Livermore Falls and looked at their Italian Sandwich Roll ingredients. They make a great roll and I changed the recipe a little because of that.


I almost followed Jeff2019 recipe. This is what I did:
I cut the salt in half and used vegetable oil instead of olive oil. The reason being is I kicked around Southern Maine restaurants for years and know the oil most places use on Italians is LaSpagnola which is only 5% olive oil. I used white sugar instead of brown.


My stand mixer is in storage so I combined everything except half the bread flour and beat it with a hand mixer for about 15 minutes. Added the rest of the bread flour, and kneaded for about another 15 minutes using a bench scraper to knead with and not incorporate more flour.


I let it rise once. Cut it into 8 rolls which were 9" long because I used a 1/4 sheet pan (9"x 13").
I sprayed them with water using dhardt suggestion and covered the rolls with a sheet of parchment. When they had risen, and were doubled in size, I sprayed them with water again. Baked them at 325 and they stayed nice and pale like they're supposed to.


They came out of the oven pretty crusty. Let them cool completely, bagged them up and let them sit overnight. They were almost perfect, still just a little heavy. I made an Italian with one, wrapped it up in parchment paper and let it sit for a bit. LOL! It's SO close.


Next time I make them, I'm going to let them proof longer. Let them go to the point they're almost overproofed and I think that's all it's going to take. I will report back!&#55357;&#56832;


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