# Espresso Machine - Help Me Pick One!



## Mylegsbig (Aug 27, 2006)

Hey guys. I want to get an espresso machine for me and my fiancee. Nothing fancy, just RELIABLE.  doesnt have to be a mocha super latte cappucino frappucino whip cream almond icecream.

i just want it to turn my delicious gourmet coffee beans into pure espresso.

How much should i be looking to spend?

can i get something for 300 dollars?

Cheers

ill reemphasize im looking for quality consistency and longevity.


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## AlexR (Aug 27, 2006)

Hi,

You've asked a fascinating question, and I'll be *very* interested to read the replies!

Wikipedia offers a good introduction : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Espresso_Machine

I've owned several brands of espresso machines through the years.

I must confess a fondness for the kind that grind whole beans rather than use pre-ground coffee

I currently use a Saeco "superautomatica FAMILY". It works just fine *except* it leaks and has to go to the repair shop twice a year :-(.

My experience altogether with these machines is that they are very fragile and need lots of after-sales service. Of course, even if the machine is guaranteed, you're minus one machine all the time the thing is in the shop :-((((.

The Nespresso solution is ideal for people who make only a couple of cups a day, but is impractical for people like me because the cost of the capules is super-expensive...

All the best,
Alex R.


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## Mylegsbig (Aug 27, 2006)

Alex i will be using whole beans to make my espresso.

i don't mind two trips to the repair shop a year.

tell me more Alex!

I like personal experiences not google links.

Thanks in advance


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## Angie (Aug 27, 2006)

We have one that gets used daily.  It's nothing fancy and it costs us around $70.00.  We got it at Walmart.com back in 2003.  We have never had a problem with it...


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## AlexR (Aug 27, 2006)

Pressure is a key factor. The more the pressure (up to a certain degree, of course!) the more flavor will be extracted from the coffee.

I found this Web link: http://www.aabreecoffee.com/rating.cfm?itemID=22
but my machine cost nowhere near this much!

Here's the Saeco site: http://www.aabreecoffee.com/rating.cfm?itemID=22

Here's one on sale by Amazon at $ 500 : http://www.amazon.com/Saeco-Vienna/dp/customer-reviews/B00005LVWQ

I think you need to pay this sort of price for a quality machine, but others may think differently.

Best regards,
Alex R.


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## lulu (Aug 27, 2006)

I have NEVER had better espresso than with fresh ground beans in a coffer grinder and then a stove top Italian caffettiera.  We have them in the tiny size, a medium for four cups and the biggest size for when we have frinds for supper.  Its unbeatable in my opinion.....and the money you save can bbe spent on excellent beans!  It takes just moments to turn skimmed milk into froth if you fancy a cappucino and fills the kitchen with the smell of satisfaction.   My husband worked for what is considered the premium coffee maker in UK stores like Harrods while he was a student one summer....we sure drank a lot of that stuff, but still agreed that our stove top model provided superior espresso and was better value for money.

I know a lot of people don't like the fuss of filling the coffee, but my guess is it takes me thirty seconds to fill and two minutes max to wash...

in any case I hope you enjoy your fancy model!  I don't mean to rain on your parade...just giving my caffiene soakerd opinion!


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## AlexR (Aug 27, 2006)

I have had very decent "stove top Italian caffettiera" too, but what about the _crema_???
Your stove top coffee is a different beast, good enough in its own way, just not _espresso_!
I obviously accept your preference, but would just like to stress that we are talking about *different drinks*, a bit like comparing percolated coffee (of which _caffettiera_ is a variety http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffee_percolator & http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caff%C3%A9), instant coffee, and espresso coffee.

I also found this thread on Fodor's: http://fodors.com/forums/threadselect.jsp?fid=2&tid=34653085

I might add that:
- my experience is that you need to make at least one cup for the machines to reveal their full potential
- they tend to be very messy : which is why I recommend the machine I referred to: the grounds fall into a drawer, and you can put the grinding unit into the dishwasher

Best regards,
Alex R.


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## urmaniac13 (Aug 29, 2006)

I second the opinion of Lulu wholeheartedly. It is quite simple to use and clean, I don't find it any more trouble than a fancy machine.


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## Half Baked (Aug 29, 2006)

I have the real fancy one that takes up 2' of counter space so I took it to the basement.  I'll bring it up when the I have holiday company for dinner or brunch.

I use the one like Lulu's also.


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## lulu (Aug 29, 2006)

Perhaps its because Urmaniac13 and I have the Italian men to make the Italian coffee in the Italian caffettiere!  I honestly find it very very clean and quick to use on a daily, ok, a few times a day, basis.


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## urmaniac13 (Aug 29, 2006)

Actually, the shocking truth is, Lulu, Cristiano, a true Roman to his bones, has one "sin", he doesn't like authentic Italian style coffee (Espresso).  

He likes the aroma, but find it too bitter to drink.  I introduced him to those diluted coffee that is commonly drunk among the parts of the world we came from, doctored it with bucketful of sugar, milk and cocoa powder, now he is very fond of that concoction!! 

Anyway we keep the mokka (stove top coffee maker) for our guests, also when we make some desserts like tiramisu, so it is being used fairly regularly anyway


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## lulu (Aug 29, 2006)

NO!  Not possible, I cannot believe it!  An Italian who doesn't like espresso?  For a start, how does he face venturing out on to those Roman roads, huh?  LOL (wink wink!)


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## urmaniac13 (Aug 29, 2006)

lulu said:
			
		

> NO! Not possible, I cannot believe it! An Italian who doesn't like espresso? For a start, how does he face venturing out on to those Roman roads, huh? LOL (wink wink!)


 

Tell you the truth he is one daredevil when he is out on the road... he really thinks himself to be a Michael Schumacher out there... Luckily he does have good skill to support his antics though, it gets a bit worrysome at times... He does drink at least half litre of either that afore mentioned concoction or strong tea every morning though... He also loves earl grey!!


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## Mylegsbig (Aug 29, 2006)

urmaniac13 said:
			
		

> I second the opinion of Lulu wholeheartedly. It is quite simple to use and clean, I don't find it any more trouble than a fancy machine.



I bought one of these things and it's amazing!

and it was only 20 dollars!

What a waste of money dropping three hundred on some dumb machine.

i like manly espresso, not that latte frappucino crap, so this works perfect for me?


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## lulu (Aug 29, 2006)

Glad you like it, Mylegsbig.

And should you have non espresso loving guests, like that weird non -real  coffee drinking Roman guy (lol Urmaniac!) it IS versaltile.  We make "latte"incorrectly I am sure, but nicely, simply by adding the same quantity of heated milk as espresso to a warmed cup, and if you have guests who want a cappucino, skimmed milk holds froth the best, just whip it in a milk pan, it takes seconds.


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## Mylegsbig (Aug 29, 2006)

lulu said:
			
		

> Glad you like it, Mylegsbig.
> 
> And should you have non espresso loving guests, like that weird non -real  coffee drinking Roman guy (lol Urmaniac!) it IS versaltile.  We make "latte"incorrectly I am sure, but nicely, simply by adding the same quantity of heated milk as espresso to a warmed cup, and if you have guests who want a cappucino, skimmed milk holds froth the best, just whip it in a milk pan, it takes seconds.




my honey badgers eats guests.  but thanks for the reccomendation!


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## lulu (Aug 29, 2006)

Er, honey badger, as in Mellivora capensis?  You have pet Mellivorinae???


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## htc (Aug 29, 2006)

MLB - I have a saeco vienna superautomatic espresso machine. It's a good starter machine. I bought mine for about 350 (that includes shipping), it was a refurbished one. I've never had a problem with it. Esspresso/coffe has nice crema. Took a few tries to get a setting I enjoy. Now use on a daily basis. 

Did a lot of research when trying to find one that fit my needs. The link below is to the machine I have. Check out the rest of the website and look at the consumer reviews. Those are usually pretty good.

http://www.wholelattelove.com/Saeco/vienna.cfm

Couple other good sites:
http://www.espressoguy.com/buying_guides/coffee_beans
http://www.espressotec.com/icguide.asp


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## Mylegsbig (Aug 29, 2006)

lulu said:
			
		

> Er, honey badger, as in Mellivora capensis?  You have pet Mellivorinae???



i dont know about that, but he's a friendly little [SIZE=-1]mustilidae[/SIZE].

his name is Fluffy.


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## Mylegsbig (Aug 29, 2006)

htc said:
			
		

> MLB - I have a saeco vienna superautomatic espresso machine. It's a good starter machine. I bought mine for about 350 (that includes shipping), it was a refurbished one. I've never had a problem with it. Esspresso/coffe has nice crema. Took a few tries to get a setting I enjoy. Now use on a daily basis.
> 
> Did a lot of research when trying to find one that fit my needs. The link below is to the machine I have. Check out the rest of the website and look at the consumer reviews. Those are usually pretty good.
> 
> ...



hey mate, thanks for the reco, but i bought that 20 dollar aluminum oldschool device,the one apparently every italian has in their kitchen


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## AlexR (Aug 29, 2006)

I don't deny that a $ 20 contraption can make a decent cup of coffee.

But espresso, it ain't.

And espresso lovers are not impressed.  

Best regards,
Alex R.


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## Mylegsbig (Aug 31, 2006)

AlexR said:
			
		

> I don't deny that a $ 20 contraption can make a decent cup of coffee.
> 
> But espresso, it ain't.
> 
> ...




i love espresso. and i love the 20 dollar contraption  Wasnt that thing the first espresso maker and still being used in every italian==


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## urmaniac13 (Aug 31, 2006)

MLB, you have done a right thing, and you are right!!  those things ARE for making real espresso coffees (In Italy, they simply call it "cafe", it is their regular coffee!!), and what you are making is exactly that.

I am glad you are enjoying it!!


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## kitchenelf (Sep 11, 2006)

My next trip to my favorite kitchen/gourmet food shop I will buy one of the authentic Italian espresso makers (like MLB's).  I keep meaning to buy one but somehow I keep walking out without one!  :-(


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## LeCros (Oct 15, 2006)

*Saeco 'family expresso machine*

In support of Alex R, I have been using a SAECO Superautomatica Family machine since 1999. I find it gives extemely good coffee with strongly pronounced flavour. The  pressure is all important. I did have a lot of problems initially when I bought it from a catering supplier in Borgo San Lorenzo (near Florence). It simply didn't work properly; so I took it back to the UK service agent in Croydon on my return to England. They refused to touch it as it hadn't been bought in England. They told me it would have to be taken back to the place where I bought it. I put it in the boot of my car and returned to B san L. A most surprised shopkeeper was there. After some 'discussions' he telephoned the factory in Bologna. They said that I should take it back to London (Croydon) where they would ensure the fault(s) were recified. I did this .......and it has given me no trouble since. I look after it meticulously since it is being used on a frequent basis at our B&B/Gite operation near Bordeaux. (Alex R nb). I use only mineral water for fear of 'gumming up' the complicated internal workings. LeCros


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## Snoop Puss (Oct 15, 2006)

The stove top ones are OK, but if you do get one, I would choose to buy stainless steel not aluminium. I moved away from a stove top coffee maker to a Mini Moka 15-bar pressure espresso machine. Everyone comments on how good the coffee is, even with fairly ordinary coffee. You get a good crema on the top, which you don't get with a stove top pot, and the taste really is incomparable. My machine cost €130. I've had it five years and have never had a problem with it. I too use mineral water due to its cleaner taste and smell than tap water. Descaling tablets are available to deal with any lime build-up should this develop.

The fundamental factor is pressure. Mine is 15 bar, I've seen 19 bar but have never tried the coffee. There is no point getting less than 15 bar, even though you see 4 and 10-bar machines about. I personally would get a separate grinder. A bit more inconvenient, but some friends have had the grinder fail on combined units. Also, make sure the one you opt for will take ground coffee. It's surprising how many machines nowadays will only work with "pods".

A bit depends on how 'automatic' you want the whole process to be and how much counter space you have. Some of these machines are a fair size. I wouldn't buy one from Amazon, for example, without seeing one in a shop to give myself an idea of how big it is.


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## Snoop Puss (Oct 15, 2006)

I should have added one other comment. The spout for heating and frothing the milk takes a surprising amount of time to heat the milk. For an ordinary cafe con leche/latte, there's enough crema on the espresso to create a bit of pleasing froth. For a latte, I heat the milk in the cup and then drip the coffee in on top. Delicious. No better way to start the day.

If you want a cappucino, heat the milk in the microwave (for example) first and then give it a froth using the spout. Saves you time and it saves you wasting water from the machine's tank.


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## lulu (Oct 16, 2006)

re cappucino with coffee from a stove top machine.....its very quick.  I like skimmed milk and its quicker and easier to frother, but full cream milk or semi skimmed works too.  Just put the milk, in a milk pan (!) on the hob and whisk.  Skimmed makes a stable froth in seconds, full cream in half the time the coffe has taken.

Cappucino lovers wanting a stove top should not be put off.   I usually have a latte or a capucino in the morning rather than espresso.....the milk content makes it breakfast as far as I am concerned.


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## urmaniac13 (Oct 31, 2006)

*this is for Charlotte...*

Charlotte, I tried to PM you but your box is full and I can't reply to your question, so I will post it here... though I don't have a very helpful answer I wanted to respond to you all the same...

I am not quite sure of the availability of replacement parts in Canada, here stove top espresso maker is a very popular everyday item, we bought ours from a street vendor for 6€ (like 8 or 9 CAD), and replacement parts like the rings are readily available at kitchen/hardware shops.
Unfortunately I am not at all familiar with how the circumstances are in Canada when it comes to this type of coffee makers, but you may want to inquire about it at a large, well equiped shops of this sort, or a coffee specialty shop, or check on ebay(the only problem with ebay for something like this though, you may have to pay more for S/H than the item itself!).
I hope you will be able to find it, but if you can't let me know... if you could tell me the exact design or demention, I may be able to get it for you here.


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