# Coffee filters: natural or bleached?



## Greg Who Cooks

I'm totally mystified. I've always purchased the natural (buff colored, unbleached) filters because they are of course ... natural! Why add extra processing? And where is all that bleach going out to pollute our rivers and groundwater?

But really? I've inherited a batch of bleached filters and I can't tell the difference between coffee made in one or the other. And does bleaching change anything? I'm not even sure if white isn't the natural color and the "natural" coffee filters may be artificially colored.

I guess I'll keep buying the buff colored filters if there's no good reason to prefer one over the other...

So anybody/everybody, please tell me whether you prefer bleached or unbleached coffee filters, and why?


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## Andy M.

We use a coffee maker with a fine metal mesh filter.  No bleach/artificial coloring, no paper in the landfill.  Just rinse it out and you're set.


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## Greg Who Cooks

Actually that's a different question. I've used reusable filters (metal or other mesh) at times (not recently) and I recall both positive and negative results, but too many years ago for me to remember why.

But I still wonder, bleached or unbleached? (I'll consider mesh when I've run out of my current stock, probably sometime early summer. (I usually buy big packages.)


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## taxlady

I have one of those fine mesh filters. It's great to have it as backup, in case I run out of unbleached, paper filters. I get tired of fine coffee crumbs at the bottom of the pot. If it weren't for that, I would use it all the time.

I always buy the unbleached filters, since they became available. That colour is the colour of unbleached paper. Bleaching costs money. Cheap paper products are that colour, e.g., brown paper bags and paper hand towels in public washrooms.


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## Andy M.

taxlady said:


> ...I get tired of fine coffee crumbs at the bottom of the pot. If it weren't for that, I would use it all the time...




Yeah, I just leave a little extra coffee in the pot.


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## Dawgluver

You said you inherited a bunch of bleached cfs, right, Greg?  They can be used for a lot of other things too.  I line a colandar and drain yogurt for cheese, for example.  There're web pages listing a lot of other uses somewhere that I read recently.  They can replace paper towels for draining meat, hold servings of popcorn or other snacks, etc.


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## Silversage

I'm a real coffee snob.  I only buy whole beans.  Only certain brands and at certain places.  They can only be freshly ground moments before brewing, not the night before.  If I could, I would roast them at home before grinding.

But I have tried both bleached & unbleached filters and I must reluctantly admit that I can't taste a difference.  

On principle, I prefer things unbleached and minimally processed, but I buy whatever is available at the moment.


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## 4meandthem

I buy unbleached and buy whatever coffee is sale for the most part. I like folgers colombian,Medallia doro,Maxwell house,Dunkin donuts etc. I like mixing it up a bit, and I am not a coffee snob at all. I think it makes me appreciate a really good cup of coffee that much more when i have one.

I do like the one cup drip set-up for a cup of joe for flavor, but I have been drinking too much to that.

Anyone see Aeroshot? it is an inhaler that equals 1 cup of joe's caffeine per puff.
When you need that extra punch!


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## Aunt Bea

4meandthem said:


> I buy unbleached and buy whatever coffee is sale for the most part. I like folgers colombian,Medallia doro,Maxwell house,Dunkin donuts etc. I like mixing it up a bit, and I am not a coffee snob at all. I think it makes me appreciate a really good cup of coffee that much more when i have one.
> 
> I do like the one cup drip set-up for a cup of joe for flavor, but I have been drinking too much to that.
> 
> Anyone see Aeroshot? it is an inhaler that equals 1 cup of joe's caffeine per puff.
> When you need that extra punch!



I use the cheapest filters I can find.

I agree on the coffee!

I enjoy good coffee but, if I drink it all the time then the WOW factor is lost.  I only buy good coffee for holidays and special occasions.  I  usually mix  the end of one can with the beginning of the next can to help with the transition from one brand to another.  This is known as the house blend!


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## Andy M.

4meandthem said:


> ...Anyone see Aeroshot? it is an inhaler that equals 1 cup of joe's caffeine per puff.
> When you need that extra punch!



A steaming hot cup of coffee does more for me than provide a jolt of caffeine.  I don't leave the house until after the second cup has had a chance to work its magic.

...if you know what I mean.


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## GLC

I use bleached for two reasons, neither of them very compelling. One is that white bleached filters are more readily accessible. The other is that there is general agreement that unbleached paper can impart undesired flavors. 

Now I said neither was compelling. Most coffee filter paper today is no longer chlorine bleached. It is oxygen "cleansed." Melita has been doing that since 1992. So does Bunn, so it's not hard to find chlorine free papers. 

All this gets a little murky, because Elemental Chlorine Free (ECF) methods use chlorine dioxide gas. Elemental chlorine bleaching is the really bad environmental process. ECF is less bad but still produces some dioxins, but there's little or not environmental difference between ECF and Totally Chlorine Free (TCF). Again, Melita has used TCF bleached paper since 1992. And it's worth noting that just being brown doesn't make a filter necessarily made with TCF pulp. Pulp can go through a lot of processing. This is also an issue in teabags. (And tampons, etc.) 

Now I had not been aware before of Melita's claim that paper filters remove the cholesterol raising factors in coffee, while permanent metal filters allow it through. But that's another story.


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## FrankZ

When I use filters I used the bleached ones mostly because I have some, and the disc filters are hard to find to start with, much less in unbleached.


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## taxlady

FrankZ said:


> When I use filters I used the bleached ones mostly because I have some, and the disc filters are hard to find to start with, much less in unbleached.



disc filters?


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## Sir_Loin_of_Beef

I have one of those reusable "gold" coffee filters. I use it to filter the used canola oil from my deep fryer if I am going to use the oil again. I have a Senseo coffeemaker and a Krups Home Cafe to make coffee, they both use pods, and AFAIK, they only come in white. I would never use the gold filter for coffee because sooner or later you'll be having coffee with the rotorooter man, and I don't swing that way.

That said, if I had to make a choice between the brown or white filters, I would choose whichever is biodegradable, and if both are, then I'd choose the cheapest available.


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## Sir_Loin_of_Beef

Aunt Bea said:


> I use the cheapest filters I can find.
> 
> I agree on the coffee!
> 
> I enjoy good coffee but, if I drink it all the time then the WOW factor is lost. I only buy good coffee for holidays and special occasions. I usually mix the end of one can with the beginning of the next can to help with the transition from one brand to another. This is known as the house blend!


 
If your coffee comes in a can, it is NOT good coffee. Really good coffee is made with pure Aribaca beans and comes in a resealable foil bag with a breather valve on the front.  But I do agree with buying the cheapest filters you can find. The only purpose of the filter is to keep the grounds out of the pot. It providses nothing, positive or negative, to the finished product!


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## Sir_Loin_of_Beef

Andy M. said:


> A steaming hot cup of coffee does more for me than provide a jolt of caffeine. I don't leave the house until after the second cup has had a chance to work its magic.
> 
> ...if you know what I mean.


 
Go to the Vitamin or supplement store and get yourself a bottle of psylium capsules (Metamucil). Take 4 with your juice. You'll never have to rely on the coffee again!  An added benefit is it also absorbs and removes cholerterol.


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## FrankZ

taxlady said:


> disc filters?



Flat discs that go in the bottom of the percolator basket.

I don't make coffee that way often (only for my parents at the house or when I am on the boat) so I don't go through them quickly.


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## Sir_Loin_of_Beef

GLC said:


> This is also an issue in teabags. (And tampons, etc.)


 
I would never use a tea bag, or any kind of paper tea filter. Tea's flavour is very delicate and YOU CAN TASTE THE PAPER! A stainless steel tea ball or a stainless steel infuser built into the pot is best.


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## Andy M.

Sir_Loin_of_Beef said:


> ...I would never use the gold filter for coffee because sooner or later you'll be having coffee with the rotorooter man, and I don't swing that way...



Please explain.


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## Greg Who Cooks

taxlady said:


> I have one of those fine mesh filters. It's great to have it as backup, in case I run out of unbleached, paper filters. I get tired of fine coffee crumbs at the bottom of the pot. If it weren't for that, I would use it all the time.


Yeah, I guess that's why I quit using the mesh, because I grind my coffee finely and didn't like the sediment at the bottom.



Dawgluver said:


> You said you inherited a bunch of bleached cfs, right, Greg?  They can be used for a lot of other things too.  I line a colandar and drain yogurt for cheese, for example.  There're web pages listing a lot of other uses somewhere that I read recently.  They can replace paper towels for draining meat, hold servings of popcorn or other snacks, etc.


My mother moved to assisted care and gave me her bleached filters. They're otherwise same as the ones I use all the time. There's no point in using them for anything else since I can't taste any difference.

The funny thing is that my generic filters (Krogers) cost the same price regardless of bleached or natural. I'll just use up the bleached filters and then go back to my natural ones.



Silversage said:


> On principle, I prefer things unbleached and minimally processed, but I buy whatever is available at the moment.


I'll continue buying unbleached, perhaps on that principle, or perhaps I just prefer the color. As I said there's no cost difference in my local stores.



GLC said:


> I use bleached for two reasons, neither of them very  compelling. One is that white bleached filters are more readily  accessible. The other is that there is general agreement that unbleached  paper can impart undesired flavors.


You're the first that's brought up any "general agreement that unbleached  paper can impart undesired flavors." I haven't tasted any difference, nor as far as I can see has anybody else posting in this topic.

Accessibility? Not sure what you mean. I always see both colors on the shelves here in L.A. supermarkets.


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## taxlady

I sometimes see both colours available at the supermarket. Last pack, I had to go to the health food store to get the unbleached ones.


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## justplainbill

Years back, over my wife's objections, I bought about 1200 Melitta unbleached paper cone filters.  We grind enough coffee daily for 4 to 8 cups and use 1 to 2 filters per day.


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## Alix

So many questions and so many smart aleck comments running through my head whilst reading this thread. I'm being good though, not going to start any kind of stuff today. 

I have a crapload of both types of filters floating around my house. I typically bought the bleached filters because I could get them uber cheap at Costco. Any unbleached filters are the leftovers from when Mom moved into assisted living. I use neither one for coffee at the moment as my Keurig is doing the job just fine and it has a tiny little meshy thing.


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## Sir_Loin_of_Beef

Andy M. said:


> Please explain.


 
Rinsing coffee grounds down the kitchen sink is a recipe for disaster.


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## Alix

Sir_Loin_of_Beef said:


> Rinsing coffee grounds down the kitchen sink is a recipe for disaster.



Why?


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## Andy M.

Sir_Loin_of_Beef said:


> Rinsing coffee grounds down the kitchen sink is a recipe for disaster.



Been doing it for decades, both with had without a food waste disposer.  Never had an issue.  I stopped throwing grounds in the trash because of the smell they generate.

You can dump coffee grounds down the drain or in the trash whether you use a metal mesh filter or a paper one.  You seemed to be equating a metal coffee filter with roto-rooter issues.


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## taxlady

My mother swore by putting coffee grounds down the drain. She said they absorbed grease and help keep the drains running well. When someone told her that their plumber said not to do that, she replied, "What do you expect? He makes more money if you don't do it."


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## Greg Who Cooks

Sir_Loin_of_Beef said:


> Rinsing coffee grounds down the kitchen sink is a recipe for disaster.


 
I _never_ put anything down the drain that can be more easily thrown in the trash. I'd rather go to a bit extra labor taking out trash than pay the drain man. I'm not buying the story about the grounds cleaning the fat. I avoid putting fat down the drain too, although at least lye helps clean fat clogs, but does nothing for coffee grounds.


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## justplainbill

Coffee grinds are acidic.  Acid and brass do not go well together.


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## Andy M.

justplainbill said:


> Coffee grinds are acidic.  Acid and brass do not go well together.



Not a lot of brass in plumbing these days.  Besides, lots of acidic items go down the drain and no one has issued warnings on them.


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## Dawgluver

I put my coffee grounds along with the (bleached) coffee filters in the compost bin, along with veg scraps and egg shells.


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## taxlady

Dawgluver said:


> I put my coffee grounds along with the (bleached) coffee filters in the compost bin, along with veg scraps and egg shells.



I do that when it isn't winter.


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## Dawgluver

taxlady said:
			
		

> I do that when it isn't winter.



I keep a covered pail on the counter, then empty outside in the compost heap.


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## taxlady

Dawgluver said:


> I keep a covered pail on the counter, then empty outside in the compost heap.



I'm just not up for keeping a path to the composter cleared through the snow.


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## GLC

taxlady said:


> I do that when it isn't winter.



I do it, except on alternate Tuesdays when the moon is full and the wind is out of the east, UNLESS a dove has pooped on my car during the night. In that case, on the way to the compost bin, I fling it at the dove.


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## FrankZ

taxlady said:


> I'm just not up for keeping a path to the composter cleared through the snow.



Kathleen bought a Natures Mill composter and it sits in our pantry.  I have to empty the bin to a bucket outside every few weeks.


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## Dawgluver

FrankZ said:
			
		

> Kathleen bought a Natures Mill composter and it sits in our pantry.  I have to empty the bin to a bucket outside every few weeks.



It really does cut down on garbage, we have like 1/4 trash can to put out each week, compared to neighbors who don't recycle or compost, and who put out 3-4 or more full cans.

Coffee grounds make for great compost too!


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## taxlady

FrankZ said:


> Kathleen bought a Natures Mill composter and it sits in our pantry.  I have to empty the bin to a bucket outside every few weeks.



Very nifty. I don't think I will be getting one of those just yet. The Canadian places seem to sell versions that start at $399.

Maybe I should try worm composting.


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## taxlady

Dawgluver said:


> It really does cut down on garbage, we have like 1/4 trash can to put out each week, compared to neighbors who don't recycle or compost, and who put out 3-4 or more full cans.
> 
> Coffee grounds make for great compost too!



Coffee grounds can be used as mulch without even composting them. So can tea leaves.

Yeah, I notice the difference in the amount of garbage we put out in winter. But, we do the recycle thing as well, so it really isn't huge amounts of garbage.


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## Dawgluver

taxlady said:
			
		

> Very nifty. I don't think I will be getting one of those just yet. The Canadian places seem to sell versions that start at $399.
> 
> Maybe I should try worm composting.



TL, I just have a nice looking copper pail with a lid.  It merely sits on the counter, and doesn't do anything else other than hold scraps till we dump it.  I think I got it from Gardens Alive, but any small container with a lid would do.


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## taxlady

Dawgluver said:


> TL, I just have a nice looking copper pail with a lid.  It merely sits on the counter, and doesn't do anything else other than hold scraps till we dump it.  I think I got it from Gardens Alive, but any small container with a lid would do.



Yeah, but then I have to take it out the back patio door, which we don't use in winter, through the snow to the composter.


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## Greg Who Cooks

So... Composters: natural or bleached?


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## Dawgluver

Gourmet Greg said:
			
		

> So... Composters: natural or bleached?


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## FrankZ

Gourmet Greg said:


> So... Composters: natural or bleached?




Ermm.. green?


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## GLC

Gourmet Greg said:


> So... Composters: natural or bleached?



42


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## Alix

GLC said:


> 42



That is the answer, but what is the question?


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## GLC

taxlady said:


> Very nifty. I don't think I will be getting one of those just yet. The Canadian places seem to sell versions that start at $399.
> 
> Maybe I should try worm composting.



I made a bin last weekend. (The chickens have been kicking stuff out of the open cage bin.)  This one begins as one of those blue plastic 55 gallon drums. That material cuts easily with small saws. I cut a door out of the side and hinged it with a piano hinge pop riveted on. Then I drilled holes all over the sides and ends. Installed four small bolt on eyebolts in a line, two in the door and one either side. A wire with a bent end as a stopper keeps it closed. Easy to roll back and forth periodically. I'll make another, so I can let one get near full and finish while starting to fill another. Less than $30 for all components.


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## Greg Who Cooks

Alix said:


> That is the answer, but what is the question?



42 - Google Search


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## PrincessFiona60

Good thing I had a towel handy...


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## Kayelle

I'm thinking about the thread "do you read every post"?  I did, and some are hysterical. 
I could care less if my coffee filters are bleached or unbleached.  I *do care *about unbleached toilet paper in other parts of the world.  You read that right, if you have never had the occasion to have nothing but unbleached toilet paper available, you would never care again about bleached or unbleached coffee filters.  There are priorities in life after all.


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## Greg Who Cooks

Kayelle said:


> I'm thinking about the thread "do you read every post"?  I did, and some are hysterical.  I could care less if my coffee filters are bleached or unbleached.



Thanks. It makes me feel good that my topic had no worth. I had just wondered if there was any reason to prefer either. I had suspected that there was no difference. I guess now I know, and I also know that composting coffee grounds is more important than which filters you use.


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## taxlady

GLC said:


> I made a bin last weekend. (The chickens have been kicking stuff out of the open cage bin.)  This one begins as one of those blue plastic 55 gallon drums. That material cuts easily with small saws. I cut a door out of the side and hinged it with a piano hinge pop riveted on. Then I drilled holes all over the sides and ends. Installed four small bolt on eyebolts in a line, two in the door and one either side. A wire with a bent end as a stopper keeps it closed. Easy to roll back and forth periodically. I'll make another, so I can let one get near full and finish while starting to fill another. Less than $30 for all components.



I have a full sized composter in my backyard. I live in Quebec. I have feet of snow in my backyard. I don't need another outdoor composter in my tiny yard. I either find a cheap, easy way to compost indoors in winter or it will continue to go in the garbage until the snow melts.


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## Dawgluver

Gourmet Greg said:
			
		

> Thanks. It makes me feel good that my topic had no worth. I had just wondered if there was any reason to prefer either. I had suspected that there was no difference. I guess now I know, and I also know that composting coffee grounds is more important than which filters you use.



I think the upshot was, use either bleached or unbleached, it doesn't matter, Greg.  This made for really good discussion, and we thank you for bringing it up!  We have been known to veer off topic at times....


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## Greg Who Cooks

Yeah DL and I know what you mean. Thanks for confirming what I had suspected all along, that probably appearances are far more important than performance when it comes to coffee filters. Various replies in this topic seem to indicate that either (1) the replies agreed with me that bleached vs. natural had no taste influence at all, (2) that maybe natural filters might "save the environment" but too much vagueness to tell for sure, or that (3) throwing your coffee grounds down the drain will either save or ruin your drains, and a belated (4) composting your coffee grounds will probably have an end result of making me want to quit drinking coffee. (Is there an emoticon for sad grin?)

But at least I know the answer for my initial question. No, Greg, there is no practical difference between bleached and natural coffee filters. It's all in your mind, it's all in a product concept. There is no practical difference 'twixt the two.

It's interesting that such an innocuous question could get 6 pages of replies.


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## FrankZ

Gourmet Greg said:


> It's interesting that such an innocuous question could get 6 pages of replies.



Tis all a matter of perspective.. barely two full pages for me...   

In this day and age so many people will break their own necks to jump on the "natural" bandwagon, when sometimes it matters not.  A good discussion and some thinking helps, even on such a insignificant seeming topic like coffee filters.


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## Greg Who Cooks

Forum default setting.

You and I are in agreement about the "jump on natural" movement. That is why I posted my question in the OP. I'm not interested in jumping on any bandwagon unless there's solid reasons. I haven't seen any yet in this topic, or at least any that seem to justify merit.

As far as I'm concerned the difference between bleached and natural is purely cosmetic, unless solid reasons to the contrary can be stated.


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## gadzooks

Snob, here. I have used unbleached or oxygen-bleached four cup (Mrs. Tea) filters in my eight cup Revere Drip-O-Lator for years, but both have been difficult to find in that size lately, so I dug out my old Chemex pot and bought three boxes of unbleached filters. Perfect coffee, consistently.


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## Addie

GLC said:


> I do it, except on alternate Tuesdays when the moon is full and the wind is out of the east, UNLESS a dove has pooped on my car during the night. In that case, on the way to the compost bin, I fling it at the dove.


 
This is the winner folks!


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## Addie

So does this mean that those who use unbleached filters to save the environment and the earth are like those 'organic' snobby folks? I guess I am in big trouble. I use house brand and whatever is the cheapest. And the only food I buy that is orgnaic is fresh carrots. For some strange reason, they taste more like a carrot should. Or as I remember it from my childhood. And I don't grind my coffee. I buy Folgers or the house brand if on sale. I am doomed.


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## Zhizara

Addie said:


> So does this mean that those who use unbleached filters to save the environment and the earth are like those 'organic' snobby folks? I guess I am in big trouble. I use house brand and whatever is the cheapest. And the only food I buy that is orgnaic is fresh carrots. For some strange reason, they taste more like a carrot should. Or as I remember it from my childhood. And I don't grind my coffee. I buy Folgers or the house brand if on sale. I am doomed.



You're not alone.  Did you know that if you run out of filters, a paper towel works just fine.


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## taxlady

Zhizara said:


> You're not alone.  Did you know that if you run out of filters, a paper towel works just fine.


I am very skeptical of using paper towels for filtering coffee, or as some folks have mentioned here, for filtering stock. I don't know what kind of chemical residue is left in the paper towels. They don't really make them for that kind of food use.


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## Greg Who Cooks

taxlady said:


> I am very skeptical of using paper towels for filtering coffee, or as some folks have mentioned here, for filtering stock. I don't know what kind of chemical residue is left in the paper towels. They don't really make them for that kind of food use.


+1

I'll use a paper towel in an emergency but they are not a suitable replacement for a filter designed for coffee.

I've just run out of bleached filters today and now using natural colored filters. Perhaps it's my imagination but it seems to taste better.

 (Both are Kroger brand Mr. Coffee style.)


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## bakechef

I don't have any concrete proof that "bleached" products are bad for you, but why do things have to be bleached in the first place?  Why do coffee filters have to be white, when the brown serve the same purpose?  Why did they start bleaching flour?  Yeah, some bleached flours produce a slightly better result in cakes and things with a fine crumb, but not a huge difference for the average cook.


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## Greg Who Cooks

I've never heard nor read anything believable that unbleached is more healthy than bleached. (That's either flour or coffee filters.) I think it's solely an appearance issue.

Bleached better in baked? Other than the color? I presume bleached flour makes whiter cakes. (I wouldn't know. I make breads not cakes. My bread doesn't need to be white. In fact I like my bread to be rustic. Most or all of my breads are savory breads.)


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## Andy M.

bakechef said:


> I don't have any concrete proof that "bleached" products are bad for you, but why do things have to be bleached in the first place?  Why do coffee filters have to be white, when the brown serve the same purpose?  Why did they start bleaching flour?  Yeah, some bleached flours produce a slightly better result in cakes and things with a fine crumb, but not a huge difference for the average cook.



Interesting thing about flour.  It all starts out being off white.  As flour sits and ages, it whitens naturally so even unbleached flour is white.  If you are a high volume flour miller, the last thing you want to do with flour is stick it in a warehouse until it whitens naturally.  So you bleach it so you can get it out the door and cash in.  

I understand there are very minor differences in performance.  

This from Wikipedia:  _Flours treated with bleaches and improving agents generally show higher loaf volume and finer grain. However, people with very sensitive palates can detect a slight bitter aftertaste. 

__Chlorinated cake flour  improves the structure forming capacity, allowing the use of dough  formulas with lower proportions of flour and higher proportions of sugar. In biscuit  manufacturing, chlorination of flour is used to control the spread –  treated flour reduces the spread and provides a tighter surface. The  changes of functional properties of the flour proteins are likely to be caused by their oxidation._


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## bakechef

Gourmet Greg said:


> I've never heard nor read anything believable that unbleached is more healthy than bleached. (That's either flour or coffee filters.) I think it's solely an appearance issue.
> 
> Bleached better in baked? Other than the color? I presume bleached flour makes whiter cakes. (I wouldn't know. I make breads not cakes. My bread doesn't need to be white. In fact I like my bread to be rustic. Most or all of my breads are savory breads.)



Something about the bleaching process that creates a softer, finer texture.  Almost all cake flours are bleached, with an exception of one made by King Arthur Flour, and they even admit that using their product in place of regular cake flour will produce a slightly heavier cake.  There is an explanation in the Cake Bible, but I don't have that book, I borrowed it from the library.


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## Addie

From bleached coffe filters to bleached flour. I would say that they are sold to us because we associate "white" with purity.


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## gadzooks

Well, as previously stated, I am in the "unbleached" bleachers, but...I use oxygen bleached filters when un- are unavailable, but continue to shun chlorine bleached filters because of the environmental damage the used bleaching slurry does to watersheds and water tables, as well as the chloriney taste they impart to coffee. I'm not selling a point of view, just stating a preference. Flour? I buy unbleached, mostly whole wheat or whole grain, except for cakes. I like dense, chewy breads but not dense, chewy cakes.


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## Greg Who Cooks

For the second day my coffee with unbleached filters tastes better. Maybe it's real, maybe it's my imagination. This is certainly not a scientific test and I'm not going to buy more unbleached filters so I could do an A-B test. I'm just happy the unbleached filters are gone. (They were a gift. I never buy bleached coffee filters.)


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## SlimHippo

You can buy chrome filter machines that allow you to stop using paper. Although there are most of the new filter machines include this, they do have some retro fitting ones out there.


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## taxlady

As I mentioned in a previous post, I don't like the fine coffee crumbs that get into the coffee with the metal filters for drip machines. I almost never use my drip machine anymore.

There is no problem with crumbs in the coffee with the metal "filter" that holds the grounds for making espresso with an espresso machine (the kind with a built in pump, not little the stove top espresso makers).


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## Addie

The only reason I don't use the unbleached filters is due to my height. If I were taller, I would buy them consistently.


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