# Why you are using Standard or Metric?



## 4food (Nov 24, 2017)

That is a question I have been asking myself. Why would you, the cook , use one over the other?


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## roadfix (Nov 24, 2017)

Depends......some online or even packaged recipes or instructions use ml's and grams, then I'll follow them.

And on my kitchen scale, depending on what I'm weighing or trying to divide, I'll use ounces or grams.

Also, if a foreign tourist (which I get a lot around here) asks for directions, I use meters and kilometers.


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## buckytom (Nov 24, 2017)

I use avoirdupois and standard because that's what I've used my entire life. Metric is much easier in its base10 logic, but for some reason we've never adopted it.


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## Andy M. (Nov 24, 2017)

I am a fan of metric over pounds and ounces.  Metric makes it so simple to cut recipes down or increase them.  It just makes more sense all around.

I am also converting my recipes as I go from volume to weight measurements where appropriate.


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## CWS4322 (Nov 24, 2017)

Because I have lived in Canada since 1985, I use metric. However, I only measure when I bake, and then I use baker's percentages, which are all weighed on a scale.


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## 4food (Nov 24, 2017)

buckytom said:


> I use avoirdupois and standard because that's what I've used my entire life. Metric is much easier in its base10 logic, but for some reason we've never adopted it.


Very very interesting. I never thought standard was also called "avoirdupois". Which is French for "having weight", and the French created metric. All this is so confusing .


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## 4food (Nov 24, 2017)

Andy M. said:


> I am a fan of metric over pounds and ounces.  Metric makes it so simple to cut recipes down or increase them.  It just makes more sense all around.
> 
> I am also converting my recipes as I go from volume to weight measurements where appropriate.


What a coincidence, that's exactly what I have been doing


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## blissful (Nov 24, 2017)

I've only used weighing for baking too--and it doesn't matter which system I use. The scale I have does both.

As an interesting note...in cheesemaking I use standard measurements. Some of the books and internet media use just one or the other. The Gavin Webber in Australia uses metric but he also includes standard to appeal to a larger audience. Believe me, if you are in the middle of a recipe and it calls for only one or the other, it's just annoying to have to look up all the conversions and many authors and teachers only use one or the other. (I know because I use recipes from all different authors in different countries.) Most American authors and teachers only use standard and it is off putting to those that have to make conversions in countries where they use metric.

So, in conclusion. I write my own recipes in standard but I'm not selling a cook book. If I was, I'd try to be inclusive of both methods.


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## LPBeier (Nov 24, 2017)

I mostly weigh in grams because that is how I was taught in school and it is just more accurate for baking. If a recipe is in cups sometimes I will convert to weight and sometimes I will use my metric measuring cups. I rarely use imperial.


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## JustJoel (Nov 24, 2017)

*Easy math vs no math*

I’ve found that standard measures are fine if you’re following a recipe and not adjusting it for servings. If you’re baking, either is okay, as long as you’re consistent and use a kitchen scale (my new best friend). If you do have to make adjustments, I find that metric math is just easier. There are 1,000 grams to a kilo. What could be easier?

That kind of leads me to a question. Different flours have different weights, and sometimes the SAME flour from different companies can weigh differently! Not a real problem if the dough recipe is in weight and not volume (unless you’re using a different brand flour from the one in the recipe...). Isn’t there any standard conversion chart, at least for whole wheat, white AP, and bread flours? A difference of a few grams between different brands is acceptable. 

Maybe I’ll make this a project, but I’ll have to start a GoFundMe account so I can pay for all the flour!


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## JustJoel (Nov 24, 2017)

LPBeier said:


> I mostly weigh in grams because that is how I was taught in school and it is just more accurate for baking. If a recipe is in cups sometimes I will convert to weight and sometimes I will use my metric measuring cups. I rarely use imperial.


See my reply below, but how do adjust for the different flour weights? Whole wheat flours and AP flours all measure differently. Add bread flour in, and that’s a whole different weight. Then add all the gluten free flours, and you’ve got a real mess! Do most types of flour weigh about the same across brands? Am I making sense?


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## JustJoel (Nov 24, 2017)

CWS4322 said:


> Because I have lived in Canada since 1985, I use metric. However, I only measure when I bake, and then I use baker's percentages, which are all weighed on a scale.


I still haven’t figured out the baker’s ratio or how to use it. Maybe because I flunked math every year since the second grade?


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## Andy M. (Nov 24, 2017)

JustJoel said:


> See my reply below, but how do adjust for the different flour weights? Whole wheat flours and AP flours all measure differently. Add bread flour in, and that’s a whole different weight. Then add all the gluten free flours, and you’ve got a real mess! Do most types of flour weigh about the same across brands? Am I making sense?



The nutrition label on all flours will tell you how much a specific volume measure equals. e.g. on King Arthur All Purpose Flour, the nutrition label states ¼ cup (30 grams).  So you can extrapolate that to 120 grams/cup. Of course that requires a little multiplication.

Actually, I think all foods show that weight to volume relationship.


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## GotGarlic (Nov 24, 2017)

JustJoel said:


> See my reply below, but how do adjust for the different flour weights? Whole wheat flours and AP flours all measure differently. Add bread flour in, and that’s a whole different weight. Then add all the gluten free flours, and you’ve got a real mess! Do most types of flour weigh about the same across brands? Am I making sense?



The USDA maintains a database of foods with their weights and nutritional information. You can download it or the app, or search it online.

https://ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/search/list


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## JustJoel (Nov 24, 2017)

GotGarlic said:


> The USDA maintains a database of foods with their weights and nutritional information. You can download it or the app, or search it online.
> 
> https://ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/search/list


This is GREAT! A bit labor intensive as far as typing and clicking and waiting for the page to load (my wi-fi sucks here), but well worth the effort! THANK YOU!


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## RPCookin (Nov 24, 2017)

I use whatever format the recipe is written in.  I use weight for bread baking, and I've never found that my results vary all that much for most breads for different flours.  

I make a ciabatta from a recipe that doesn't specify flour type, and I've gotten good results from both AP and bread flour by just weighing out the recipe amounts. For the AP flour I sub some vital gluten for a little bit of the flour but I still use the total weight in the recipe.


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## caseydog (Nov 24, 2017)

I think the easy answer is that I use what I grew up with. I am ABLE to use metric, if I need too, but I normally use "standard," because it is ingrained in me -- I don't have to think about it. 

CD


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## rodentraiser (Nov 24, 2017)

I grew up learning standard and I have a much easier time imagining pounds, cups, miles and so on. I get too confused over metric, as in which is larger, a centimeter or a millimeter (in my mind, they both look the same).

Plus I tend to not be real exact about measurements all the time. If something calls for 1 1/3 cups of something, I'm just as like to fill the cup once and then fill it again to what I think is one third of the cup, so I don't dirty two cups. This works well when doubling or halving recipes. 

I like to fly by the seat of my pants when cooking and not rely on say, the weight of the flour if I'm making bread. I like to know my bread is correct by the way it looks and feels. Again, my goal isn't to become a chef, it's simply to make food I enjoy eating. 

Sometimes I wonder how many people would know what their spices were by look or smell if they took all the labels off.


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## LPBeier (Nov 24, 2017)

Andy M. said:


> The nutrition label on all flours will tell you how much a specific volume measure equals. e.g. on King Arthur All Purpose Flour, the nutrition label states ¼ cup (30 grams).  So you can extrapolate that to 120 grams/cup. Of course that requires a little multiplication.
> 
> Actually, I think all foods show that weight to volume relationship.





GotGarlic said:


> The USDA maintains a database of foods with their weights and nutritional information. You can download it or the app, or search it online.
> 
> https://ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/search/list



What they said!


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## PrincessFiona60 (Nov 24, 2017)

I use volume measure, it's what I grew up with and most of my recipes are written that way.  I am able to use metric, I have the wet measures and a scale for dry measures.  Conversions don't bother me, but I see no need to convert my TNT recipes.


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## caseydog (Nov 24, 2017)

rodentraiser said:


> I grew up learning standard and I have a much easier time imagining pounds, cups, miles and so on. I get too confused over metric, as in which is larger, a centimeter or a millimeter (in my mind, they both look the same).



I am a car guy, to the bone. Tires use the PMetric system for sizes. So, I know the section width difference between a 205 and a 215 is roughly 3/8 of an inch. I also know the other two numbers. One is a percentage, and the other is in inches. So, you have metric, a percentage and inches all in one tire size, unless you have a mid-1980s Ferrari, or Mustang/Thunderbird SVO with the Michelin TRX tires, where it is all metric and percentage. That system didn't last long. 

My head is full of useless knowledge like that. But, if you ever want to know, for some reason, what those numbers and letters on your tires mean, I'm you guy. 

CD


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## buckytom (Nov 25, 2017)

casey, many years ago I drove an Olds Cutlass Supreme that had chrome covered lug nuts that were standard size, and of course, there was a matching standard lug wrench.

Unfortunately, after many beatings by impact wrenches, the chromed covers for the lug nuts would break down and fall off.

I discovered this when I got a flat and tried to change a tire with 4 standard sized chrome covered lug nuts, and 1 metric sized because the cover had fallen off.

This was the days before cell phones and roadside assistance.

I had to walk 5 miles home, and 5 back just to bring back a metric set of wrenches and a breaker bar.


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## 4food (Nov 25, 2017)

Thank you all for playing along with my curiosity. I can see all different answers that goes from education (our foreign friends), to background from other hobbies like Caseydog or just going the easy way even so it might not be too accurate like Rodentraiser. 
In my case, I can use all of them, but prefer metric as it is so much more easier (Mainly in baking) as 1 liter is exactly 1 Kg, where water matches perfectly its equivalent in weight. For volume, I try to stay away, we know flour can be tricky by volume and going from Kosher salt to table salt has the same issue, so I prefer using my best friend, the scale.


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## tenspeed (Nov 25, 2017)

The metric system is the standard throughout most of the world, except the U.S., Myanmar, and Liberia.  The U.S. customary system is not identical to the Imperial system.  Read up:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System_of_measurement


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## Steve Kroll (Nov 25, 2017)

4food said:


> That is a question I have been asking myself. Why would you, the cook , use one over the other?



I really don't have any problem switching between metric and American measures, so I just use whatever units the recipe calls for.


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## RPCookin (Nov 25, 2017)

Just out of curiosity, what graduations are used in metric measuring spoons?  I've never seen a metric measuring spoon - every one I've ever seen uses teaspoons and tablespoons or fractions thereof.  Most liquid measuring cups have markings on opposite sides of the vessel for the different formats, but that wouldn't work for cups or spoons that are used for solid ingredients.


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## Andy M. (Nov 25, 2017)

RPCookin said:


> Just out of curiosity, what graduations are used in metric measuring spoons?  I've never seen a metric measuring spoon - every one I've ever seen uses teaspoons and tablespoons or fractions thereof.  Most liquid measuring cups have markings on opposite sides of the vessel for the different formats, but that wouldn't work for cups or spoons that are used for solid ingredients.



Milliliters (ml).  It's a measure of volume. It works for solids and liquids.


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## roadfix (Nov 25, 2017)

buckytom said:


> I had to walk 5 miles home, and 5 back just to bring back a metric set of wrenches and a breaker bar.



...or about 16 kilometers round trip....


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## buckytom (Nov 25, 2017)

Lol,


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## RPCookin (Nov 25, 2017)

Andy M. said:


> Milliliters (ml).  It's a measure of volume. It works for solids and liquids.



I pretty much knew that.  What I don't know is what are the actual measures used for each spoon?  5 ml, 10 ml, 50 ml?

More questions - why are centimeters commonly used, but centiliters not?  Why is it common to express a length as 100 millimeters or 10 centimeters, but not as one decimeter?  No matter how you measure, there are peculiarities to both systems.

I worked as a machinist for 33 years, and it became automatic to convert fractions to decimals and back on a daily basis.  Even now, after being retired for 10 years, I still see 11/16" as .6875".  I might use what was labeled as an 11/16 endmill to cut a keyway dimensioned as .750 +.001/-.000.  I knew that tool was 1/16" smaller than the cut I needed to make, so it would work for the task I needed to accomplish.  13/16 would not, because that is .8125", larger than the slot I needed to make.

When working with fractions and decimals, you just have know that your tooling and measuring gear is what is correct for the desired result.  I don't see those needs as being any different in the kitchen.  Decimal conversions aren't difficult, and for most of us in the US, aren't even necessary since the fractional measuring instruments are found in every kitchen.  Whether I use metric measuring, or convert to avoirdupois first, or convert from volume to weight, it's just necessary to have the right equipment plus a little knowledge, and it all comes out the same in the end.


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## roadfix (Nov 25, 2017)

I've seen 5 ml and 15 ml measuring spoons as they correspond to 1 tsp and 1 tbs respectively.


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## buckytom (Nov 25, 2017)

Because a teaspoon is a teaspoon, but a tablespoon just couldn't be 2 teaspoons. It had to be 2 1/2. So what's 3/4 of 2 1/2 tablespoons in teaspoons?

But 5ml is 5ml, and 10 is 10. 

3/4 of anything base10 is still easier.


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## RPCookin (Nov 25, 2017)

buckytom said:


> Because a teaspoon is a teaspoon, but a tablespoon just couldn't be 2 teaspoons. It had to be 2 1/2.
> 
> But 5ml is 5ml, and 10 is 10.
> 
> 3/4 of anything base10 is still easier.



Actually it's 3 teaspoons to a tablespoon.  3/4 of a tb would be 2¼ tsp.  



buckytom said:


> So what's 3/4 of 2 1/2 tablespoons in teaspoons?



5.625 (5-5/8) teaspoons.


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## buckytom (Nov 25, 2017)

Ya see what I mean?


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## 4food (Nov 25, 2017)

Traveling through Europe, I can't say I ever come across the equivalent of a Tsp nor Tbsp. I don't think they exist. BUT, they sometime use a coffee spoon or desert spoon or soup spoon as general references, but those are not measured like our "Tsp" and others.


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## tenspeed (Nov 25, 2017)

4food said:


> Traveling through Europe, I can't say I ever come across the equivalent of a Tsp nor Tbsp. I don't think they exist. BUT, they sometime use a coffee spoon or desert spoon or soup spoon as general references, but those are not measured like our "Tsp" and others.


  I never really thought about it, and I don't bake much.  I have a recipe for dutch oven bread that calls for 1/4 tsp. of yeast, or 1 gram.  My scale has a resolution of 1 gram, so I assume that anywhere between 0.5 grams and 1.5 grams will register 1 gram.  I commonly make a half size loaf using 200 grams of flour, so I eyeball half of 1/4 tsp.  That won't even register on the scale.  How are recipes written that call for minute quantities, such as 1/2 tsp. baking powder?


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## rodentraiser (Nov 25, 2017)

It's interesting. I notice that in the UK, even though meters and centimeters and things like that are used, they also still use miles per hour to measure speed and they also use the 1:12 scale (1 inch is equal to 1 foot) when it comes to dollhouse miniatures. That would confuse me more than just being completely metric.


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## Steve Kroll (Nov 25, 2017)

tenspeed said:


> I never really thought about it, and I don't bake much.  I have a recipe for dutch oven bread that calls for 1/4 tsp. of yeast, or 1 gram.  My scale has a resolution of 1 gram, so I assume that anywhere between 0.5 grams and 1.5 grams will register 1 gram.  I commonly make a half size loaf using 200 grams of flour, so I eyeball half of 1/4 tsp.  That won't even register on the scale.  How are recipes written that call for minute quantities, such as 1/2 tsp. baking powder?


They don't always weigh small amounts. I've seen many recipes that use volume-based measurements with amounts in ml. No different than what we do. For example, a recipe might call for 30ml of salt, or two tablespoons.


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## CWS4322 (Nov 27, 2017)

I guess because I live in Canada and have lived in Europe and have worked in commercial kitchens and have developed recipes, it is easier for me to think metric when cooking. I do the same when dyeing yarn or fleece. But I still want to buy fabric by the yard.


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## Themommychef (Nov 28, 2017)

buckytom said:


> I use avoirdupois and standard because that's what I've used my entire life. Metric is much easier in its base10 logic, but for some reason we've never adopted it.



Same!!


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## letscook (Nov 29, 2017)

64 yrs old grew up with the standard way and not changing my recipes, however....  I do have a scale that will also do metric and have tried a couple of recipes using the weighing in metric....  Not having it - Guess the old saying "Can't teach a dog a new trick" applies.


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## Andy M. (Nov 29, 2017)

Back in the 70s when President Carter tried to get the USA to change to metric, I remember the complaints.  Most centered around the fear of having to learn something new.  OMG!  Back to school!


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## RPCookin (Nov 29, 2017)

letscook said:


> 64 yrs old grew up with the standard way and not changing my recipes, however....  I do have a scale that will also do metric and have tried a couple of recipes using the weighing in metric....  Not having it - Guess the old saying "Can't teach a dog a new trick" applies.



I'm 70, and I grew up well outside of the metric system too.  I don't understand why it would be any more difficult to weigh in grams than it is in ounces.  Once you select the weighing mode, the rest is just reading the numbers as you add ingredients to the scale.  I can't "visualize" in metric like I can in ounces, but as long as I have a scale and measuring cup that read in grams and milliliters, it really doesn't make any difference to me.

As for new tricks - I hope that I never reach a point where I can't learn something new.


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## JustJoel (Dec 4, 2017)

I’ve bought a kitchen scale, finally. It measures in both avoirdupois and metric. I generally prefer metric, because the math is much easier, but I do find that some recipes, when converted to metric weight from volume, come up with some very finicky numbers (417 grams of flour? 27 grams of butter?). I do tend to use measuring spoons instead of the scale for ingredients with a small weight, and I still measure my liquids with a cup measure.

It’s amazing that I get anything done in the kitchen at all!


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## Andy M. (Dec 4, 2017)

JustJoel said:


> I’ve bought a kitchen scale, finally. It measures in both avoirdupois and metric. I generally prefer metric, because the math is much easier, but I do find that some recipes, when converted to metric weight from volume, come up with some very finicky numbers (417 grams of flour? 27 grams of butter?). I do tend to use measuring spoons instead of the scale for ingredients with a small weight, and I still measure my liquids with a cup measure.
> 
> It’s amazing that I get anything done in the kitchen at all!



I freely round off to the nearest "5".  That is, 417 become 415 and 418 becomes 420.

I also use measuring spoons for small amounts.


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