# Can't get bread to rise



## Desmond

Hi I am trying to make bread but it will not rise. Any suggestions on this recipe please. I am using SR flour.


Honey White Bread 

73g Warm water
76g Warm milk
5g Honey
6g Salt
14g Butter
282g Self raising flour
Pour flour into a bowl
Pour the remaining ingredients into a cup and warm in microwave to dissolve the honey and melt butter. Mixing occasionally
Mix into the flour.
Need on a board adding flour occasionally until a dough
Leave to settle for 1 hour
Re knead the dough
Place in a bread tin and cook for 40 minutes at 180c


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## FrankZ

I wouldn't use self rising flour.  I would suggest you use yeast.


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## Andy M.

You're following yeast dough instructions for chemically leavened dough.  As Frank said, use bread dough and yeast.


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## jennyema

Andy M. said:


> You're following yeast dough instructions for chemically leavened dough. As Frank said, use bread dough and yeast.


 
Exactly.

You've got a bad recipe on your hands.

Self-rising flour is for making biscuits and quick breads which are dense and really don't rise much at all.  And do not require resting and kneading.


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## Selkie

Use yeast.


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## CharlieD

Definitely do not use self rising flour. Unless you are using a very specific manufacturer recipe you have no idea what is in that flour and what it needs to start rising.


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## Desmond

Ok thanks. I thought that using SR flour was the same as plain flour and yeast. I make Peshwari naan bread using
170g self raising flour
8g Sugar
8g Flaked almonds
55ml milk
Using a very hot frying pan and a little oil it works fine. But it doesn't need to rise much.


I do have Backing powder and Dried active yeast. Don't know what I would do to prepare the latter if needed.
There is also fast acting yeast.


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## taxlady

With self-rising flour, it probably needs the heat of the oven to rise properly. It will actually start working a little bit once liquid is added. Leaving it to rise will allow the small amount of CO2 produced by mixing with liquid to off gas and then it won't rise as much in the oven.


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## Andy M.

With active dry yeast, you have to bloom it in warm water with a tablespoon of sugar.  Mix these ingredients together and let them sit for 10-15 minutes.  A beige-colored foam should appear on the surface.  That's your indication the yeast is beginning to work.  Them you add in the flour and any other ingredients and mix it until it's a homogeneous mass.  Knead that mass of dough for 10 minutes then place the dough in an oiled bowl, cover with plastic wrap on the surface of the dough and let it sit until it doubles in size.  You know it's ready when you stick your finger into the dough and the hole remains.  Punch down the dough to deflate it.

Then shape the bread into a loaf or place it into a loaf pan and set it aside to rise again.  Then bake and eat.


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## Addie

When using the dry yeast, you place it in warm water 105-110ºF. Then the yeast needs to be fed. Give it some flour or a tsp. of sugar. You can even give it both. It will start to ferment and when it is all bubbles, then you add it to the rest of your recipe. I do not care for the fast acting yeast. It can be finicky at times. 

Make sure your liquid that you place the yeast in, is not to hot. Too high a heat will kill it. Until you are used to using it, I would suggest you use a thermometer to check the temperature of the liquid. If it is too hot, allow it to cool down some. Then check the temperature again. 

In a pinch, you could use All Purpose flour if that is all you have on hand. And make sure you knead it until it no longer sticks to your hands.


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## RPCookin

Andy M. said:


> With active dry yeast, you have to bloom it in warm water with a tablespoon of sugar.  Mix these ingredients together and let them sit for 10-15 minutes.  A beige-colored foam should appear on the surface.  That's your indication the yeast is beginning to work.  Them you add in the flour and any other ingredients and mix it until it's a homogeneous mass.  Knead that mass of dough for 10 minutes then place the dough in an oiled bowl, cover with plastic wrap on the surface of the dough and let it sit until it doubles in size.  You know it's ready when you stick your finger into the dough and the hole remains.  Punch down the dough to deflate it.
> 
> Then shape the bread into a loaf or place it into a loaf pan and set it aside to rise again.  Then bake and eat.



Actually it doesn't even need a tablespoon of sugar.  With good active yeast you can get a good proof without any sugar at all.  For a recipe that doesn't call for sugar, I will often still use about 1/4 to 1/2 teaspoon to help kick start the yeast (it doesn't change the taste of the bread).  Water at about 110° F (43.5° C).  (Also, I store my jar of yeast in the freezer - that seems to do the best job of keeping it active for the longest time.  I've used yeast that was well over a year old with good results.)

Different breads call for different processes, but the most basic is mix the ingredients, knead for about 8-10 minutes, let rise for about 1 hour (until volume has doubled), deflate, shape the loaf or put in whatever prepared pan or pans are required, another rise to double volume (30 minutes to one hour), then bake as directed.

It's good that your recipe calls for measuring by weight.  For making bread it's a lot easier to be consistent if you at least weigh the main ingredients - that's the flour and the wet ingredients.  Hydration percentage or ratio is important for obtaining the proper texture of the finished bread.


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## taxlady

I have used recipes that called for dry yeast to be added to the flour before any liquid was added. You have to trust that your yeast is still active to use this method, but I was always successful. BTW, I read that that doesn't work with Canadian yeast, but it did.


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## Addie

taxlady said:


> I have used recipes that called for dry yeast to be added to the flour before any liquid was added. You have to trust that your yeast is still active to use this method, but I was always successful. BTW, I read that that doesn't work with Canadian yeast, but it did.



And I don't like the fast acting yeast. I find that it is an iffy product. The first time I used it, a failure. The date was still good, but who knows what happened. So the next time I certainly checked the date of freshness, and it worked find. I have had a couple of more failures with it and more successes. I now use the regular yeast. And if I can find it, I will use the fresh yeast.


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## Mad Cook

Desmond said:


> Ok thanks. I thought that using SR flour was the same as plain flour and yeast. I make Peshwari naan bread using
> 170g self raising flour
> 8g Sugar
> 8g Flaked almonds
> 55ml milk
> Using a very hot frying pan and a little oil it works fine. But it doesn't need to rise much.
> 
> 
> I do have Backing powder and Dried active yeast. Don't know what I would do to prepare the latter if needed.
> There is also fast acting yeast.


 I'm an English and have been making bread for around 50 years. Due to differences in flours and nomenclature, my advice may be slightly different to that of our friends in the USA

In the UK Dried active yeast requires you to re-activate the yeast granules with a little sugar and warm (not hot) water ie blood heat - when you put your finger in the water it should feel neither warm nor cold. You then leave it for 10 minutes to froth up. You use both the froth and the liquid and follow Andy's instructions.

Fast acting yeast is dried yeast that is put straight into the flour without re-activating it

Both these types of yeast have instructions for use printed on the package. So long as they are within date and have been stored properly I find little or no difference in the two types. As RPcooking recommends, I keep my dried yeast in the 'fridge.

Again in the UK, you would use strong bread flour for most yeast recipes unless the recipe said otherwise in which case it would be plain flour not self-raising flour.  

You can make soda bread with baking powder (a mixture of bicarbonate of soda and cream of tartar) or with self-raising flour (the former is better). Na'an bread are, in culinary terms, a form of soda bread.


I hope this helps and better luck next time.


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## salt and pepper

Add the two blue pills!


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## Mad Cook

salt and pepper said:


> Add the two blue pills!


 Umm....Two blue pills?


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## CraigC

salt and pepper said:


> Add the two blue pills!



 Especially when dealing with males over a certain age.


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## Dawgluver

salt and pepper said:


> Add the two blue pills!




  And if it lasts for more than 4 hours, call your baker...


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## Addie

You folks are something special. My kind of folk.


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## Cheryl J

Dawgluver said:


> And if it lasts for more than 4 hours, call your baker...


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## Desmond

Thanks for this. I should know how to deal with dry yeast as I am a home brewer with over 50 years of experience.


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## Desmond

I have got Allisons Dried yeast. It states on the instructions: 1tsp sugar in 150ml of warm water 1 part boiling 2 parts cold. No temperature value mentioned. I have tried this in a mixture of warm milk and sugar (35c). There is no sign of yeast activation.


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## FrankZ

35C should be fine.  I find I see some working beasties in less than a minute and by 5 I have very good action and a good head of foam.

How old is the yeast?


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## taxlady

Desmond said:


> I have got Allisons Dried yeast. It states on the instructions: 1tsp sugar in 150ml of warm water 1 part boiling 2 parts cold. No temperature value mentioned. I have tried this in a mixture of warm milk and sugar (35c). There is no sign of yeast activation.


Sounds to me like those yeasties are dead.


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## RPCookin

Desmond said:


> I have got Allisons Dried yeast. It states on the instructions: 1tsp sugar in 150ml of warm water 1 part boiling 2 parts cold. No temperature value mentioned. I have tried this in a mixture of warm milk and sugar (35c). There is no sign of yeast activation.



This method is sort of hit or miss, since it can vary a lot depending on how cold your tap water is.  Also, boiling temperature changes with elevation.

I shoot for 110°F or 43°C (most recipes that call for this specify about that temp - I have one for dinner rolls that calls for 120°F - 49°C, but that is added directly to the dry ingredients without proofing).  35°C is a bit low - at less than body temperature it would even feel cool to touch, while it should feel warm.  I usually nuke the water in the microwave for about 10 seconds at a time until it hits 105°-110°F with my instant read thermometer, then add the yeast and sugar.  I also only add 1/2 tsp of sugar unless the recipe calls for more.  1/2 tsp will give the yeast something to feed on without changing the flavor of the bread.

I also keep my yeast in the freezer to keep it fresh, then measure out what I need and let it sit on the counter for 5 minutes to "thaw".  I'm not sure that really matters, but at least it doesn't chill the proofing liquid as much.


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## Addie

I find that my dry yeast does better if it has both flour AND sugar to feed off of. And I make sure the temp is always between 110ºF-120ºF. Never have had a fail yet. When you add the warm water, the yeast come alive. So just a pinch of sugar and a larger pinch of flour should suffice. Within five minutes you should have a full bloom of the yeast.


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## RPCookin

Addie said:


> I find that my dry yeast does better if it has both flour AND sugar to feed off of. And I make sure the temp is always between 110ºF-120ºF. Never have had a fail yet. When you add the warm water, the yeast come alive. So just a pinch of sugar and a larger pinch of flour should suffice. Within five minutes you should have a full bloom of the yeast.



If one has the time, it's a good idea to make a poolish or biga (also called a sponge) to proof and develop the yeast.  It can be made anywhere from 2 hours to a day ahead of when you want to start mixing the dough, and gives the yeast a little more time to ferment.  

I usually make a poolish in the bowl of my KA mixer the evening before I'm going to make ciabatta, and leave it out on the counter covered overnight.  That way its ready to just add the rest of the ingredients and mix and knead with the dough hook.


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## Addie

RPCookin said:


> If one has the time, it's a good idea to make a poolish or biga (also called a sponge) to proof and develop the yeast.  It can be made anywhere from 2 hours to a day ahead of when you want to start mixing the dough, and gives the yeast a little more time to ferment.
> 
> I usually make a poolish in the bowl of my KA mixer the evening before I'm going to make ciabatta, and leave it out on the counter covered overnight.  That way its ready to just add the rest of the ingredients and mix and knead with the dough hook.



I have done that too. But I think the best one I ever made was from grapes. They were covered in wild yeast and made the most delicious poolish. It took about a week for all of the grapes to be eaten by the yeast. But I had me some glorious loaves of bread from those grapes inspired yeast. I kept feeding it each day with flour and just a pinch of sugar. I also had to add some additional warm water a couple of times. I did have to skip one day as it was growing out of control. I transferred it to a bigger container. I used the final piece for a huge large family size pizza.


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## CharlieD

Addie said:


> You folks are something special. My kind of folk.




It took me s while to figure it, thanks for your post, it don on me that it was a joke. I didn't know what "blue pils were". Guess I'm not old enough.


Sent from my iPhone using Discuss Cooking


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## Addie

CharlieD said:


> It took me s while to figure it, thanks for your post, it don on me that it was a joke. I didn't know what "blue pils were". Guess I'm not old enough.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Discuss Cooking



Congratulations! You are then the lucky one!


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## judys

I know this post is a few days old but I found this in the King Arthur's website: http://www.kingarthurflour.com/blog/2014/08/04/my-bread-didnt-rise/


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## Andy M.

judys said:


> I know this post is a few days old but I found this in the King Arthur's website: "My Bread Didn't Rise" - Flourish - King Arthur Flour



Good link, thanks.


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## Mad Cook

Desmond said:


> I have got Allisons Dried yeast. It states on the instructions: 1tsp sugar in 150ml of warm water 1 part boiling 2 parts cold. No temperature value mentioned. I have tried this in a mixture of warm milk and sugar (35c). There is no sign of yeast activation.


has the package of dried yeast been open for a while? Is it out of date? Been kept it a too warm area? It could have just got tired and given up the ghost? I store mine in an airtight container in the 'fridge. 

1 part boiling to 2 parts cold water is what I usually allow and if you use yeast in beer making you would know to let it stand for 10 minutes or so, so it isn't that.

It sounds as though the yeast is faulty. I use Allinsons dried yeast and don't have any problems with it normally. I also use Doves Farm fast acting yeast which is OK but not quite as reliable as Allinsons IMO


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## Addie

judys said:


> I know this post is a few days old but I found this in the King Arthur's website: "My Bread Didn't Rise" - Flourish - King Arthur Flour



Welcome to DC.


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