# ISO - Help Making Stock



## mumu (Aug 19, 2013)

First attempt making stock. The rec. says to bring to simmer on low ....let it cook for along while. Question .....will it eventually simmer on that setting?  I am thinking it will but might take 4 ever? Its a good big pot of stock i have. It says in bold do not BTAB . Wanted to ask before I started.


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## Rocklobster (Aug 19, 2013)

hmmmm. I wouldn't worry too much. You have to get it up to temp. I suppose it will start to simmer eventually at a lower temp if you have the time to watch it. I just crank it, stir it occasionally to prevent stuff from sticking to the bottom, and then turn it down when it starts to roll...


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## Andy M. (Aug 19, 2013)

Rocklobster said:


> hmmmm. I wouldn't worry too much. You have to get it up to temp. I suppose it will start to simmer eventually at a lower temp if you have the time to watch it. I just crank it, stir it occasionally to prevent stuff from sticking to the bottom, and then turn it down when it starts to roll...



This is what I do as well.  I see no reason to try to get the pot to a simmer using only low heat.  It could take hours to get to simmer - a complete waste of time that doesn't produce a better end result.


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## Mad Cook (Aug 19, 2013)

mumu said:


> First attempt making stock. The rec. says to bring to simmer on low ....let it cook for along while. Question .....will it eventually simmer on that setting? I am thinking it will but might take 4 ever? Its a good big pot of stock i have. It says in bold do not BTAB . Wanted to ask before I started.


I assume that BTAB means "bring to a boil"? How odd. I would have thought it better to bring it up to temp fairly quickly and then, when it starts to simmer, turn down to a setting which maintains the temperature


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## sparrowgrass (Aug 19, 2013)

Mad Cook, crank the heat  up to get it almost to boiling, and then turn it down..  And if it does boil--no worries, really. Your stock might not be crystal clear, but it will be delicious.


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## Oldvine (Aug 19, 2013)

In my kitchen, I'm the boss.  That Wolf stove is on high, when the pot starts to boil, it gets turned down low to a simmer.


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## jennyema (Aug 19, 2013)

Bring it to a near boil and then lower it to a very gentle simmer.

Never boil your stock for more than a minute.   Impurities and fat get emulsified making the finished product cloudy and greasy.


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Aug 20, 2013)

jennyema said:


> Bring it to a near boil and then lower it to a very gentle simmer.
> 
> Never boil your stock for more than a minute.   Impurities and fat get emulsified making the finished product cloudy and greasy.



That's what an egg float is used for, to clarify the stock.  But the op isn't looking for consume, but tather, stock.  It's ok if it's a bit cloudy.  I don't mind cloudy.  I can clarify it later if need be.  Besides, cloudy make better gravy, IMHO.  The particulates add to the gravy color and texture.

Other than that, I agree 200% with what everyone else said.

If you are making a chicken stock, start by roasting the bones to add color and develop flavor.  The more skins and bones you have, the better.  Crack the bones to help release the marrow flavor and nutrients.  Chicken wings, lots of them, help develop a rich flavor and texture as well as does the carcass.  After the stock is done, remove the skin and bones.  REduce by half to concentrate the flavor.  This allows you to use less space in canning as well, as you need less stock in a recipe to get that rich chicken flavor.

Of course, this works for all kinds of fowl, fish, and pretty much, all meats.

Seeeeeya'; Chief Longwind of the North


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## Steve Kroll (Aug 20, 2013)

I'm going to go against the consensus here and agree with Jenny that you should not boil stock. In fact, when I make stock (which is on a regular basis), I barely let it come to a simmer and leave it that way for 6 hours or longer. Not even a full simmer, but occasional bubbles. And while we're on the subject, I don't stir it, either. I was taught many years ago by a friend who is a trained chef in Las Vegas that boiling and stirring stock traps the grease. By keeping the activity to a bare minimum all the fat will stay on top, where it can be easily skimmed off, resulting in a cleaner end product.


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## CarolPa (Aug 20, 2013)

jennyema said:


> Bring it to a near boil and then lower it to a very gentle simmer.
> 
> Never boil your stock for more than a minute.   Impurities and fat get emulsified making the finished product cloudy and greasy.




So that's why my chicken soup looks like dirty dishwater!!!


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## CarolPa (Aug 20, 2013)

Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> If you are making a chicken stock, start by roasting the bones to add color and develop flavor.  The more skins and bones you have, the better.  Crack the bones to help release the marrow flavor and nutrients.  Chicken wings, lots of them, help develop a rich flavor and texture as well as does the carcass.  After the stock is done, remove the skin and bones.  REduce by half to concentrate the flavor.  This allows you to use less space in canning as well, as you need less stock in a recipe to get that rich chicken flavor.
> 
> Of course, this works for all kinds of fowl, fish, and pretty much, all meats.
> 
> Seeeeeya'; Chief Longwind of the North




Would I be able to freeze the bones or carcass from a rotisserie chicken to use later for stock?


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## Andy M. (Aug 20, 2013)

Absolutely..  I freeze bones and parts until I collect enough for a 20-quart stock pot.  Just toss them all into the pot, add water to cover and some seasonings.  BTB, RTS.  Simmer for 5-6 hours.  Strain, defat, reduce, freeze.


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## Mad Cook (Aug 20, 2013)

sparrowgrass said:


> Mad Cook, crank the heat up to get it almost to boiling, and then turn it down.. And if it does boil--no worries, really. Your stock might not be crystal clear, but it will be delicious.


Sorry, my fault. I meant that it was odd to say not to bring the stock to the boil. I should read before posting!


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## Mad Cook (Aug 20, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> Would I be able to freeze the bones or carcass from a rotisserie chicken to use later for stock?


Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall recommended it on one of his "River Cottage" television cookery programmes but I've always done. I keep a "Lock and Lock" box in the freezer and add chicken bones as I finish the bird. When I have a good amount to make it worth doing (or I have time) I make stock.


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## Mad Cook (Aug 20, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> So that's why my chicken soup looks like dirty dishwater!!!


 And that's why egg whites are used to clarify stock.


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## Andy M. (Aug 20, 2013)

My chicken stock is made from a combination of bones/parts from roasted and raw chickens that I accumulate for stock.  That little sack of goodies (aside from the liver) in the cavities of whole chickens add a lot of flavor to stock.


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## Dawgluver (Aug 20, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> Would I be able to freeze the bones or carcass from a rotisserie chicken to use later for stock?



I love making stock from rotisserie carcasses, I freeze them as well.


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## CarolPa (Aug 20, 2013)

Dawgluver said:


> I love making stock from rotisserie carcasses, I freeze them as well.




My late SIL used to ask everyone to save their turkey carcass at Thanksgiving and she would make turkey soup.


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## Dawgluver (Aug 20, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> My late SIL used to ask everyone to save their turkey carcass at Thanksgiving and she would make turkey soup.



I made stock with the turkey carcass from the big bird I cooked a couple weeks or so ago, got a nice amount of stock.

Carcasses, the gift that keeps on giving!


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## Andy M. (Aug 20, 2013)

I buy two turkeys every Thanksgiving.  One for the main meal and a second small store brand one for parts for making stock and a few meals from two breasts and two thighs I freeze for later.


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## CWS4322 (Aug 21, 2013)

I was taught to roast the bones first (I do this in the oven). And to crack them. I add just a splash of vinegar when I roast them. I brown marrow bones on the stovetop and then roast them overnight in the turkey roaster. I strain the stock, let it sit in the fridge, skim off any fat/grease and then make soup or freeze the stock. My soupmaking is a two-step process. I make the stock, then I take the strained stock and make the soup. I never make broth. Which reminds me, I have two turkey carcasses in the freezer...too hot to make stock today. When turkeys are on special in the fall, we usually buy enough to have a turkey/month until April/May. Because I was away Apr into June, I still have one turkey left in the freezer that I'll probably brine and smoke in September.


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## jennyema (Aug 21, 2013)

Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> That's what an egg float is used for, to clarify the stock.  But the op isn't looking for consume, but tather, stock.  It's ok if it's a bit cloudy.  I don't mind cloudy.  I can clarify it later if need be.  Besides, cloudy make better gravy, IMHO.  The particulates add to the gravy color and texture.




Unless its cloudy because you have emulsified the fat into the stock


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Aug 21, 2013)

jennyema said:


> Unless its cloudy because you have emulsified the fat into the stock



I too place my stock in the fridge.  The fat separates from the water and solidifies on top.  I simply remove the sold mass of fat and discard it,, or use it to help light the grill.

Seeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## taxlady (Aug 21, 2013)

Steve Kroll said:


> I'm going to go against the consensus here and agree with Jenny that you should not boil stock. In fact, when I make stock (which is on a regular basis), I barely let it come to a simmer and leave it that way for 6 hours or longer. Not even a full simmer, but occasional bubbles. And while we're on the subject, I don't stir it, either. I was taught many years ago by a friend who is a trained chef in Las Vegas that boiling and stirring stock traps the grease. By keeping the activity to a bare minimum all the fat will stay on top, where it can be easily skimmed off, resulting in a cleaner end product.


I was told that you want to raise the temperature slowly to a simmer. That way you don't cause the proteins to "stiffen" before the bones have given off their flavour.


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## Addie (Aug 21, 2013)

Andy M. said:


> My chicken stock is made from a combination of bones/parts from roasted and raw chickens that I accumulate for stock.  That little sack of goodies (aside from the liver) in the cavities of whole chickens add a lot of flavor to stock.



When Chinese restaurants are placing their orders with their purveyors, they order chicken bones by the five pound box. The come frozen.


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## CarolPa (Aug 21, 2013)

CWS4322 said:


> I was taught to roast the bones first (I do this in the oven). And to crack them. I add just a splash of vinegar when I roast them. I brown marrow bones on the stovetop and then roast them overnight in the turkey roaster. I strain the stock, let it sit in the fridge, skim off any fat/grease and then make soup or freeze the stock. My soupmaking is a two-step process. I make the stock, then I take the strained stock and make the soup. I never make broth. Which reminds me, I have two turkey carcasses in the freezer...too hot to make stock today. When turkeys are on special in the fall, we usually buy enough to have a turkey/month until April/May. Because I was away Apr into June, I still have one turkey left in the freezer that I'll probably brine and smoke in September.




What is the difference between stock and broth?


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Aug 22, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> What is the difference between stock and broth?



There is a great deal of debate about this, as the terms have become nearly synonymous.  And research by many on this site hasn't made it that much clearer.  So, I prefer to look at the root words, stock and broth.  For me, stock is something that is stored to be used to make other things, i.e. metal stock, wood stock, etc.  It has a quality of its own, but is used to make other things.  And so, by association, the liquid stock we are discussing, is a flavored liquid made by  simmering a combination of bones, and/or meats, or vegetables, with minimal seasonings and other ingredients, to be stored as a flavor base for other sauces, broths, soups, and gravies.   

A broth is a stock flavored, or fortified with any of the following: spirits, vegetables, and/or seasonings.

Other definitions are also valid.  These are mine.

Seeeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## Cooking Goddess (Aug 22, 2013)

Chief, I've always figured that stock is broth reduced by 50%.  Then again, I figure wrong frequently... 





CarolPa said:


> Would I be able to freeze the bones or carcass from a rotisserie chicken to use later for stock?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I buy rotisserie chickens specifically for making soup.  I'll buy two, then we'll use one for dinner and leftovers, me reminding Himself with every knife cut "take it off the bones!  I want them for stock!"  I use the bones, skin, and trimmings from both birds to make the stock.  I then use that and the meat from the second bird, to make a copycat version of Panera's Wild Rice Cream of Chicken soup.

I rarely make a vast amount of stock.  For the volume I make I've found a shortcut to remove the bones and skin.  I make the stock in my pasta cooker.  I can lift out the perforated basket, removing all the larger stuff.  Then, when the pot cools a bit, I pour off the liquid through some cheesecloth, then skim the fat off the top when the liquid has cooled completely in the fridge...or garage, if it's winter and really cold outside.  Love me my "walk-out" cooler!


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Aug 22, 2013)

Cooking Goddess said:


> Chief, I've always figured that stock is broth reduced by 50%.  Then again, I figure wrong frequently...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I have the giant porch freezer too.  Isn't it handy?

Seeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## Andy M. (Aug 22, 2013)

As Chief said, there are several answers. Mine is this.

Stock is made with bones and meat scraps seasoned or not with some aromatic veggies etc. Broth is made without bones, just meats and/or veggies, seasoned or not.

By this definition, you cannot have vegetable stock, just broth.


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## taxlady (Aug 22, 2013)

I know it's not technically stock, but I still call it vegi stock. I think of broth as a soup or the liquid portion of something that is already soup.

And I use CG's shortcut when making stock. My stockpot has an insert like the one in a pasta pot.


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## jennyema (Aug 22, 2013)

Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> I too place my stock in the fridge.  The fat separates from the water and solidifies on top.  I simply remove the sold mass of fat and discard it,, or use it to help light the grill.
> 
> Seeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North




If the fat has been *emulsified* into the liquid due to the mechanics of boiling, this will not work.

You'll have unpleasant greasy stock.

Which is one reason you should never boil it.


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## jennyema (Aug 22, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> What is the difference between stock and broth?



Stock is made with bones.  Broth is not.


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Aug 22, 2013)

Just curious; isn't a sauce, that's been concentrated by boiling away water, called a reduction?

Seeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## CarolPa (Aug 22, 2013)

Cooking Goddess said:


> Chief, I've always figured that stock is broth reduced by 50%.  Then again, I figure wrong frequently...
> 
> 
> 
> ...




That's a great idea to make it in the pasta cooker.  I never thought I needed a pasta cooker, now I have a good use for one!


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## GotGarlic (Aug 22, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> That's a great idea to make it in the pasta cooker.  I never thought I needed a pasta cooker, now I have a good use for one!



Tongs and a spider work, too, and take up a lot less space


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## Addie (Aug 22, 2013)

GotGarlic said:


> Tongs and a spider work, too, and take up a lot less space



But if you are going to have a stock pot, make it serve two purposes. Pasta and stock.


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## taxlady (Aug 22, 2013)

Since the strainer/insert in the pasta pot or stock pot sit inside the pot, it doesn't take up much space at at all. I like the fact that I can walk away while it drips.


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## GotGarlic (Aug 22, 2013)

Addie said:


> But if you are going to have a stock pot, make it serve two purposes. Pasta and stock.



I have two different size pots with pasta inserts. I only use the inserts for steaming (usually tamales because I don't like steamed veg) because it requires way too much water to fill either of the pots enough to cover the insert and up the side to have enough water to boil the pasta. 

Then when you pull the insert out, you have a piece of dripping hot metal to put down somewhere. Then you need another pot to strain the liquid into. Maybe CG has worked out a better method, but it doesn't work for me.


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## GotGarlic (Aug 22, 2013)

taxlady said:


> Since the strainer/insert in the pasta pot or stock pot sit inside the pot, it doesn't take up much space at at all. I like the fact that I can walk away while it drips.



It does if you already have a stock pot but not a pasta pot


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## taxlady (Aug 22, 2013)

GotGarlic said:


> It does if you already have a stock pot but not a pasta pot


Okay, gotcha.

I pull the insert out, then tilt it and let it drain into the pot I just pulled it out of.


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## Mad Cook (Aug 22, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> What is the difference between stock and broth?


In our family stock is the liquid you add when cooking a dish or making gravy or soup, while broth is a "thin" soup rather like consommé (sorry, can't do an accent over the "e" on this keyboard) but with "bits" in it (vegetables, meat, etc.) Mind you, that begs the question of Scotch Broth which is a thick soup. 

You pays your money and you takes your choices.


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## GotGarlic (Aug 22, 2013)

Andy M. said:


> As Chief said, there are several answers. Mine is this.
> 
> Stock is made with bones and meat scraps seasoned or not with some aromatic veggies etc. Broth is made without bones, just meats and/or veggies, seasoned or not.
> 
> By this definition, you cannot have vegetable stock, just broth.



This is the definition used in culinary school. 

I have poached chicken breasts in water with thyme, parsley stems, peppercorns and a bay leaf for just 20 minutes or so, to use for chicken salad. Then I strain the seasonings and save the broth for making rice.


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## GotGarlic (Aug 22, 2013)

Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> Just curious; isn't a sauce, that's been concentrated by boiling away water, called a reduction?
> 
> Seeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North



Can be. Are you thinking of demi glace?


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Aug 23, 2013)

GotGarlic said:


> Can be. Are you thinking of demi glace?



Yes, but with more than just beef.  Turkey, chicken, ham, pork, even fish (fume' anyone?) can all be made into wonderful stocks, and then into so many more things.  A reduction of turkey stock makes a wonderful base liquid for a home made turkey pot pie, for instance.

Seeeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## CarolPa (Aug 23, 2013)

GotGarlic said:


> I have two different size pots with pasta inserts. I only use the inserts for steaming (usually tamales because I don't like steamed veg) because it requires way too much water to fill either of the pots enough to cover the insert and up the side to have enough water to boil the pasta.
> 
> Then when you pull the insert out, you have a piece of dripping hot metal to put down somewhere. Then you need another pot to strain the liquid into. Maybe CG has worked out a better method, but it doesn't work for me.




I have a few different sizes, also, but none with a pasta insert.  I think that would work well when I'm making chicken stock for soup.  Much better than trying to fish everything out of it.  I can never have too many utensils or pots and pans.  I don't know why I held off so long on a pasta pot!

Now that I know NOT to let the stock boil, I am going to try again come winter, and soup weather.  No more dirty dish water!  LOL


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## taxlady (Aug 23, 2013)

GotGarlic said:


> I have two different size pots with pasta inserts. I only use the inserts for steaming (usually tamales because I don't like steamed veg) because it requires way too much water to fill either of the pots enough to cover the insert and up the side to have enough water to boil the pasta.
> 
> Then when you pull the insert out, you have a piece of dripping hot metal to put down somewhere. Then you need another pot to strain the liquid into. Maybe CG has worked out a better method, but it doesn't work for me.


I agree with GG that it takes too much water for making pasta. It also takes more water to make stock. I don't use it when making smaller amounts of stock - that can double the amount of water needed, then I have to reduce the stock more. That makes enough extra work and time to lose any advantages.


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## GotGarlic (Aug 23, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> I have a few different sizes, also, but none with a pasta insert.  I think that would work well when I'm making chicken stock for soup.  Much better than trying to fish everything out of it.  I can never have too many utensils or pots and pans.  I don't know why I held off so long on a pasta pot!
> 
> Now that I know NOT to let the stock boil, I am going to try again come winter, and soup weather.  No more dirty dish water!  LOL



No need to wait till winter  I have a few quarts of chicken broth or stock I've made over the last few months that I just stick in the freezer, so it's ready when I want to make that first pot of soup. Sometimes I use it for making rice or a sauce as well.


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## CarolPa (Nov 4, 2013)

Mad Cook said:


> And that's why egg whites are used to clarify stock.




How do I do this?


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Nov 4, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> How do I do this?



This = Elements: The Consommé | Michael Ruhlman is a wonderful explanation and technique for clarifying stock.  I couldn't improve on this man's tutorial if I worked on it for a day and a half.

Seeeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## CarolPa (Nov 4, 2013)

Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> This = Elements: The Consommé | Michael Ruhlman is a wonderful explanation and technique for clarifying stock.  I couldn't improve on this man's tutorial if I worked on it for a day and a half.
> 
> Seeeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North




So, to make sure I understand, I make my chicken stock from whatever recipe I use, and then use this method to clarify it after it's finished.  Is that right?


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## jennyema (Nov 4, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> So, to make sure I understand, I make my chicken stock from whatever recipe I use, and then use this method to clarify it after it's finished. Is that right?


 
Yes.


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## Roll_Bones (Nov 4, 2013)

Excellent discussion.



Oldvine said:


> In my kitchen, I'm the boss.  That Wolf stove is on high, when the pot starts to boil, it gets turned down low to a simmer.



I understand Wolf makes one of the best gas ranges you can buy.  Jeff Smith "frugal gourmet" used one on his show.
Looked very nice.



Steve Kroll said:


> I'm going to go against the consensus here and agree with Jenny that you should not boil stock. In fact, when I make stock (which is on a regular basis), I barely let it come to a simmer and leave it that way for 6 hours or longer. Not even a full simmer, but occasional bubbles. And while we're on the subject, I don't stir it, either. I was taught many years ago by a friend who is a trained chef in Las Vegas that boiling and stirring stock traps the grease. By keeping the activity to a bare minimum all the fat will stay on top, where it can be easily skimmed off, resulting in a cleaner end product.



I have never paid this much attention to a giant pot of simmering bones and veggies before. But I do complement you wanting things perfect.
I just throw everthing into the stock pot, fill with water, bring to rolling boil, then I turn it down to low and let it simmer (bubbling simmer) for 2-3 hours. Cool, Strain, de-fat and store in small containers in freezer until needed.
I use it all the time.



Mad Cook said:


> And that's why egg whites are used to clarify stock.



This interests me!



Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> I too place my stock in the fridge.  The fat separates from the water and solidifies on top.  I simply remove the sold mass of fat and discard it,, or use it to help light the grill.



Chief. How do you use the renderings as fire starter?  I know it will burn, but how do you use it?



Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> I have the giant porch freezer too.  Isn't it handy?



Chief. Is the porch heated?  I have a chest freezer in my basement and was told that under 50º F, the freezer may not operate correctly?
But, I have also seen outdoor freezers in Alaska (on TV) and wondered who is off their rocker? Or are there freezers that work in the low temps?
I mean the ambient temp in many cases could be much lower than the freezer temp. I am asking.



taxlady said:


> And I use CG's shortcut when making stock. My stockpot has an insert like the one in a pasta pot.



What a delightful idea. I like it and will implement an insert next time I make stock.


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Nov 4, 2013)

Roll_Bones said:


> Excellent discussion...




Chief. How do you use the renderings as fire starter?  I know it will burn, but how do you use it?

Roll_Bones; First, I like your online moniker.  It reminds me of a short story by Harlan Ellison called "Gonna Roll The Bones"  I wonder how many people realize that to "roll the bones" means to throw the dice. 

But to answer your question, I save my used cooking oil in a large jar.  After cooking some kind of meat where fat is rendered out during the cooking, I simply empty the hot, liquid fat to the jar of used cooking oil.    But if I'm going to save the fat, to use for cooking, I'll pour it into a pot of boiling water.  I then turn off the stove, pour the water into a suitable container, and refrigerate it.  When cold, I lift off the solid, mostly clean fat, and put it into a bowl.  I then nuke it, or remelt it in a clean pan, then carefully pour it through a paper towel and into a clean jar for storage in the fridge.

The fat that was mixed into the used cooking oil is poured over crumpled newspaper and left to soak in.  The paper is already in the bottom of my Webber kettle, under the charcoal grate.  I put the charcoal on the grate and light the paper.  The fat-saturated paper burns long enough to completely ignite the charcoal, or wood.  By the time I have the food prepared to go on the fire, the fire is ready.  This is a fast way to light the charcoal, and leaves no petroleum taste on the food.  It also saves me from having to dispose of used cooking-oil/excess fat.

Chief. Is the porch heated?  I have a chest freezer in my basement and  was told that under 50º F, the freezer may not operate correctly?
But, I have also seen outdoor freezers in Alaska (on TV) and wondered  who is off their rocker? Or are there freezers that work in the low  temps?
I mean the ambient temp in many cases could be much lower than the freezer temp. I am asking.

I have a small porch that is simply stairs, railing, and a roof, all in front of my entry door.  My outside fridge is simply the outside air, especially in the 40 something temps of autumn and fall.  It allows me to chill food quickly, and without having to use electricity.  My deep freeze is in my basement too.

In the winter, I often use the outside air to freeze things before I put them into the freezer.  Sometimes, I use the car as my fridge or freezer, to keep critters away from things that might attract them.  I always use metal, covered containers to maximize temperature transfer, and a rack to allow air to flow all around the container.

The advantage of using the outside air, is that it takes up no space in my fridge, and allows me to chill large amounts of food for holiday get togethers.  It's great for chilling beverages.  It's a pretty common practice in my part of the world.

Seeeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## CarolPa (Nov 4, 2013)

Hmmm.  I remember back in the 50's my parents rented out a small apartment on the second floor of our home.  One young couple moved in during the winter and didn't have a refrigerator.  They put a wooden box out on the porch roof and kept their perishibles in that box until they could get a small used fridge.  That was the only time I've seen that done, but it is a very good idea!  Also, storing things in your car.  I guess a shed would work, too.  My husband puts pies on the porch to cool but I'm always afraid a critter will come and get them.


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## PrincessFiona60 (Nov 4, 2013)

I love a good sale on milk in the winter.  I can keep it on the porch or in the car, bringing it in as I need it.  That's why last winter was so disappointing for temps, it was too warm to count on my outside freezer.


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## Roll_Bones (Nov 4, 2013)

Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> Chief. How do you use the renderings as fire starter?  I know it will burn, but how do you use it?
> 
> Roll_Bones; First, I like your online moniker.  It reminds me of a short story by Harlan Ellison called "Gonna Roll The Bones"  I wonder how many people realize that to "roll the bones" means to throw the dice.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the clarification on the outdoor freezer.

I see about starting the fire.  I use a chimney starter with newspaper.  And I do add a couple drops of oil to the newspaper before I light it.  The oil helps it out and does a better job than just dry newspaper.  Especially when there is no breeze.

My screen name comes from my favorite band. "Rush".  They have a song called "Roll the Bones".

No Youtube function on this forum?


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## taxlady (Nov 4, 2013)

Roll_Bones said:


> Thanks for the clarification on the outdoor freezer.
> 
> I see about starting the fire.  I use a chimney starter with newspaper.  And I do add a couple drops of oil to the newspaper before I light it.  The oil helps it out and does a better job than just dry newspaper.  Especially when there is no breeze.
> 
> ...


Like this?

Rush - Roll The Bones - YouTube

It's so simple it took me a while to figure out.  Find the video you want to post. Copy and paste the URL of the video into your Post. Not as a photo or as a link. Just plain pasted into the message.


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## Mad Cook (Nov 4, 2013)

PrincessFiona60 said:


> I love a good sale on milk in the winter. I can keep it on the porch or in the car, bringing it in as I need it. That's why last winter was so disappointing for temps, it was too warm to count on my outside freezer.


This reminds me of the Christmas we had hordes to feed and there was no room in the 'fridge for the turkey to defrost. It spent 24 hours in the boot of my car!


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## taxlady (Nov 4, 2013)

Mad Cook said:


> This reminds me of the Christmas we had hordes to feed and there was no room in the 'fridge for the turkey to defrost. It spent 24 hours in the boot of my car!


For PF, me, and a number of others here, that wouldn't work - too cold outside.


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## Mad Cook (Nov 4, 2013)

Re keeping freezers in basements/garages/other unheated rooms. The following article appeared in "Which" a consumer magazine in the UK

Best freezers for your garage - Freezer reviews - Kitchen - Which? Home & garden


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## Andy M. (Nov 4, 2013)

Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> ...But if I'm going to save the fat, to use for cooking, I'll pour it into a pot of boiling water.  I then turn off the stove, pour the water into a suitable container, and refrigerate it.  When cold, I lift off the solid, mostly clean fat, and put it into a bowl.  I then nuke it, or remelt it in a clean pan, then carefully pour it through a paper towel and into a clean jar for storage in the fridge...



Chief, I'm curious why you do all this to save fat.  I just cool it a bit and pour it through a strainer lined with a men's hankerchief I save for this purpose.


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## taxlady (Nov 4, 2013)

I'm not saying that it won't damage a freezer to keep it outside in really cold weather. But, a friend of mine from small town Maine said that loads of people do it there with no problems.


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## Andy M. (Nov 4, 2013)

Every Thanksgiving, when I brine the turkey, it goes in a 20-quart pot in the back of SO's SUV overnight.  Otherwise, on the back deck with a couple of big rocks on the lid.


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## PrincessFiona60 (Nov 4, 2013)

taxlady said:


> For PF, me, and a number of others here, that wouldn't work - too cold outside.



Yup, most of the time it's colder outside than it is in my fridge.  No defrosting happening  Lots of frosting.  (it was snowing!!!!)


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Nov 4, 2013)

I put the grease into hot water because it clarifies it for me.  Most of the particulate is gone from the fat.

I kinda learned the trick when I cooked a pulled pork, and then put the juices into a container, then into the fridge.  There was plenty of wonderfully flavored pork stock, with lots of little meat particles floating around.  The particles settled in the liquid, leaving the fat that floated on top of the water clean and ready to be used for other things.  I removed the hardened, chilled fat and remelted it so that I could put it into a lidded jar, and into the fridge.

For bacon fat, I usually just pour it into a heat-proof container and use it as is.

I guess that for me, there are different grades of rendered fat, with different purposes, i.e. full flavored with bits, strained  through a paper towel, and clarified for when I want an almost flavorless fat, like lard.

I can't imagine using straight up bacon fat in my apple pie, or to make a delicate roux.  I will use it in my baked beans, or to fry an egg in, or even like butter (lower cholesterol than butter) on my pancakes.  Hence the reason why I have different flavor levels of fat.  And yeh, I know, I'm crazy.

Seeeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## jennyema (Nov 4, 2013)

Andy M. said:


> Every Thanksgiving, when I brine the turkey, it goes in a 20-quart pot in the back of SO's SUV overnight.  Otherwise, on the back deck with a couple of big rocks on the lid.



Goes into a gigantic ziplock, into a cooler and on to my front porch right in beautiful dorchester.


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## CarolPa (Nov 4, 2013)

I don't think you're crazy Chief.  Just really thrifty.  The rest of us are wasting all that fat that can be recycled.


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## Andy M. (Nov 4, 2013)

Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> I put the grease into hot water because it clarifies it for me.  Most of the particulate is gone from the fat...



I strain it through a handkerchief.  No particulates.


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## taxlady (Nov 4, 2013)

I think I will try the Chief's hot water trick for the chicken fat that accumulates on top of the stock. I find it too soft to just remove and the stock is jellied, so I always end up with stock in the chicken fat. Schmaltz has lots of uses. I often use it to make roux, which I keep in the fridge. It stays fine for months.


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## Roll_Bones (Nov 5, 2013)

taxlady said:


> Like this?
> It's so simple it took me a while to figure out.  Find the video you want to post. Copy and paste the URL of the video into your Post. Not as a photo or as a link. Just plain pasted into the message.



Are you something!  Like this?


5oYLAd2H0Cg


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## Roll_Bones (Nov 5, 2013)

taxlady said:


> Like this?
> It's so simple it took me a while to figure out.  Find the video you want to post. Copy and paste the URL of the video into your Post. Not as a photo or as a link. Just plain pasted into the message.



Are you something!  Like this?

Rush roll the bones lyrics - YouTube

Its not working for me taxlady. I have firefox and can do it on another forum that is set up like this one.
They have a youtube "wrap" like above for "Wrap HTML Images" You just put the link in between the < >.  Like that but its a youtube wrap.


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Nov 5, 2013)

Roll_Bones said:


> Thanks for the clarification on the outdoor freezer.
> 
> I see about starting the fire.  I use a chimney starter with newspaper.  And I do add a couple drops of oil to the newspaper before I light it.  The oil helps it out and does a better job than just dry newspaper.  Especially when there is no breeze.
> 
> ...



I'm familiar with "Roll The Bones" by Rush.  My favorite song by them is "Trees", where the oaks and maples fight amongst themselves until the law of the hatchet, axe, and saw settles the matter.

Rush is an incredible ban.  But then again, I'm a big fan of most progressive rock.  Everyone who knows me knows that my favorite bads are, in this order, Yes, Emerson Lake and Palmer, and Rush.  Jethro Tull fits into that group as well.  But you can have the Moody Blues.

Seeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## taxlady (Nov 5, 2013)

Roll_Bones said:


> Are you something!  Like this?
> 
> 
> 5oYLAd2H0Cg





Roll_Bones said:


> Are you something!  Like this?
> 
> Rush roll the bones lyrics - YouTube
> 
> ...


So, did you post those as links? Both of those links work, but aren't embedding the video. I use FF as well.

Okay, next question. Are you posting in WYSIWYG or BB code mode? I just tested and it only seems to work in WYSIWYG mode. Top right hand corner of the "posting window" has a square with A/_*A*_. That toggles between modes.


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## Rocket_J_Dawg (Nov 5, 2013)

Chief Longwind Of The North said:


> I'm familiar with "Roll The Bones" by Rush.  My favorite song by them is "Trees", where the oaks and maples fight amongst themselves until the law of the hatchet, axe, and saw settles the matter.
> 
> Rush is an incredible ban.  But then again, I'm a big fan of most progressive rock.  Everyone who knows me knows that my favorite bads are, in this order, Yes, Emerson Lake and Palmer, and Rush.  Jethro Tull fits into that group as well.  But you can have the Moody Blues.
> 
> Seeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North



Looks like we have some of the same favorites Chief. If I could add some of mine, and maybe yours, Hendrix, BTO, Black Sabbath, Audio Slave, Springsteen, Collective Soul, Finger Eleven, Foreigner, Green Day, Kings of Leon, Zeppelin.......jeez.....I could go on and on.


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## CarolPa (Nov 6, 2013)

Rocket_J_Dawg said:


> Looks like we have some of the same favorites Chief. If I could add some of mine, and maybe yours, Hendrix, BTO, Black Sabbath, Audio Slave, Springsteen, Collective Soul, Finger Eleven, Foreigner, Green Day, Kings of Leon, Zeppelin.......jeez.....I could go on and on.




May I ask without offending, Are either or both of you in your late 40's?  My son loves Rush and most of the other groups mentioned.  He is 48.


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## GotGarlic (Nov 6, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> May I ask without offending, Are either or both of you in your late 40's?  My son loves Rush and most of the other groups mentioned.  He is 48.



I'm guessing yes  Rush is one of my husband's favorite bands, too, as well as several of the others Rocket mentioned. He's 51.


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## CarolPa (Nov 6, 2013)

GotGarlic said:


> I'm guessing yes  Rush is one of my husband's favorite bands, too, as well as several of the others Rocket mentioned. He's 51.




At the risk of sounding like my mother, it all sounded like just a lot of noise to me!  LOL


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## PrincessFiona60 (Nov 6, 2013)

I'm 53 and I like those bands.

Now, are we making stock or what?


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Nov 6, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> May I ask without offending, Are either or both of you in your late 40's?  My son loves Rush and most of the other groups mentioned.  He is 48.



Add ten years and you got me.

Seeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## Rocket_J_Dawg (Nov 6, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> May I ask without offending, Are either or both of you in your late 40's? My son loves Rush and most of the other groups mentioned. He is 48.


 
57 Carol


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## CarolPa (Nov 6, 2013)

PrincessFiona60 said:


> I'm 53 and I like those bands.
> 
> Now, are we making stock or what?




As a matter of fact, to get back on topic, I have the carcass of a rotisserie chicken simmering even as I type!

I'm not saying how old I am, but old enough to have a 48 year old son!  You do the math!


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## GotGarlic (Nov 6, 2013)

The other great band from that era is Steely Dan. I heard a radio interview with Don Fagen recently and started listening to Steely Dan on Pandora. Love it 

I need to make stock this morning, too. I got some beautiful carrots and parsnips from the farmer's market last weekend to go in.


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## Rocket_J_Dawg (Nov 6, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> As a matter of fact, to get back on topic, I have the carcass of a rotisserie chicken simmering even as I type!
> 
> I'm not saying how old I am, but old enough to have a 48 year old son! You do the math!


 
When you roast the chicken carcass do you strip off all the meat or is it ok to leave some on?

Mrs D is 48 as well so I can figure it out.


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## GotGarlic (Nov 6, 2013)

I remove most of the meat, but I don't get obsessive about it.


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## CarolPa (Nov 6, 2013)

Rocket_J_Dawg said:


> When you roast the chicken carcass do you strip off all the meat or is it ok to leave some on?
> 
> Mrs D is 48 as well so I can figure it out.




I never did this before, but I'm going by a recipe I found online.   We ate the chicken for dinner last night.  I pulled off the leftover meat, leaving all the bits and pieces clinging to the carcass.  We didn't eat the wings, so they are still attached, whole.  I also added the uncooked neck and giblets.  Simmering with a whole onion, celery, carrots, peppercorns.  When it's finished I will strain it through cheesecloth, refrigerate and remove any fat that solidifies on top.  At that point, I will decide if it needs to be clarified with the egg whites as instructed yesterday.  When I make the soup, I will add some fresh carrots and celery and cut up chicken from last night's dinner, along with some noodles.  Season to taste.  

I cooked my own chicken yesterday, beer can chicken, but the recipe I followed for the stock was for using a commercial rotisserie chicken.  Same thing.  DH said he's not going to eat it because you can't make chicken soup from a chicken that has already been cooked.  LOL   Doesn't matter than his brother has done it for years with the turkey carcass from Thanksgiving.


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## CarolPa (Nov 6, 2013)

GotGarlic said:


> I remove most of the meat, but I don't get obsessive about it.




I think it's better to remove the bulk of it, because it will have no flavor after it simmers.  Why waste it?


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## GotGarlic (Nov 6, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> I think it's better to remove the bulk of it, because it will have no flavor after it simmers.  Why waste it?



Isn't that what I said? I just don't pick at every little piece clinging to the bones.

I do pretty much the same to make stock but I also add a couple bay leaves, thyme sprigs, and parsley stems. When I stem parsley for other dishes, I put the stems in a bag in the freezer for this purpose. Why waste them?


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## Andy M. (Nov 6, 2013)

I'd remove the meat as you would if you were going to toss the bones.  Any meat remaining on the bones will flavor the stock.  When you make a soup where you plan to add leftover chicken, add it at the end so it just heats through.  It doesn't need to be cooked with the veggies and rice or noodles, etc.


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## Chief Longwind Of The North (Nov 6, 2013)

Andy M. said:


> I'd remove the meat as you would if you were going to toss the bones.  Any meat remaining on the bones will flavor the stock.  When you make a soup where you plan to add leftover chicken, add it at the end so it just heats through.  It doesn't need to be cooked with the veggies and rice or noodles, etc.



That's what I do, except that I cube it and lightly brown it in butter until it's just done through.  I add the cooked cubes to the bowls when the soup is served.  Then, the meat tastes as good as the soup.

For a twist, add some small cubes of Havarti cheese to the soup in the bowl.  Good stuff.

Seeeeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## CarolPa (Nov 6, 2013)

GotGarlic said:


> Isn't that what I said? I just don't pick at every little piece clinging to the bones.
> 
> I do pretty much the same to make stock but I also add a couple bay leaves, thyme sprigs, and parsley stems. When I stem parsley for other dishes, I put the stems in a bag in the freezer for this purpose. Why waste them?




I was agreeing with you, not trying to improve on what you said!!


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## GotGarlic (Nov 6, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> I was agreeing with you, not trying to improve on what you said!!



Sorry, I misunderstood


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## taxlady (Nov 6, 2013)

I often leave some meat on the chicken carcass. It's 'cause I have been picking at the carcass and I make the stock (or put the carcass in the freezer to accumulate with other chicken bones) and it has reached the point that I have to do something RIGHT NOW or it might go off.


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## Rocket_J_Dawg (Nov 6, 2013)

Thanks for all the tips guys. I've made beef stock before but never chicken.


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## FrankZ (Nov 6, 2013)

Andy M. said:


> ...with a couple of big rocks on the lid.




Afraid it might get away?


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## CarolPa (Nov 6, 2013)

GotGarlic said:


> Sorry, I misunderstood




I also have to be careful how I word things.  When talking face to face you can see the persons facial expressions and hear the tone in their voice.


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## Andy M. (Nov 6, 2013)

FrankZ said:


> Afraid it might get away?



No.  No legs on the pot.

Afraid critters may get in.


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## Rocket_J_Dawg (Nov 6, 2013)

Andy M. said:


> No. No legs on the pot.
> 
> Afraid critters may get in.


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## CarolPa (Nov 7, 2013)

Rocket_J_Dawg said:


>




Cute!


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## menumaker (Nov 7, 2013)

Like the poppy MC. Can't get one here in France as they do a different thing so my Daughter always buys a 2nd one on my behalf


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## Addie (Nov 7, 2013)

CarolPa said:


> Hmmm.  I remember back in the 50's my parents rented out a small apartment on the second floor of our home.  One young couple moved in during the winter and didn't have a refrigerator.  They put a wooden box out on the porch roof and kept their perishibles in that box until they could get a small used fridge.  That was the only time I've seen that done, but it is a very good idea!  Also, storing things in your car.  I guess a shed would work, too.  My husband puts pies on the porch to cool but I'm always afraid a critter will come and get them.



On the farm, the summer kitchen was our outside freezer. When we moved to Boston, my father nailed a box to the outside sill of the window and that became our winter freezer.


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## RPCookin (Nov 7, 2013)

taxlady said:


> I often leave some meat on the chicken carcass. It's 'cause I have been picking at the carcass and I make the stock (or put the carcass in the freezer to accumulate with other chicken bones) and it has reached the point that I have to do something RIGHT NOW or it might go off.



We have wings fairly often, and I save the wing tips in the freezer until I have several bags, then I thaw them, roast them a bit to add some flavor, then make my stock from them.  I also do a mirepois, roasted with the chicken pieces, and a bouquet garni.  Simmer for a few hours, remove the all the chunky stuff and reduce it a bit if necessary to get the flavor I want.


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## Addie (Nov 7, 2013)

When I make a stock with the carcass the whole thing goes right in the pot. There is never enough meat on the bones to pick off, so I strain it and just toss to carcass out. It has served it purpose well. Carrots, celery and an onion go right in the pot with the carcass and go out with it. They get a good wash first. But I don't bother to peel them.


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