# Anyone else losing money today?



## roadfix (Sep 29, 2008)

I try not to pay that much attention but I can't help notice the numbers today.  Boy, the market's taking a big hit.


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## GhettoRacingKid (Sep 29, 2008)

polotics polotics etc....

the comapnys got them selves into this mess. 

Im not going to get started on it.


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## roadfix (Sep 29, 2008)

texasgirl said:


> I'm unemployed, does that count as losing money?? LOL
> Seriously, I'm too scared to gamble whether in a casino or Wall Street.



We're not talking about trading.  We're talking about our retirement funds.


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## texasgirl (Sep 29, 2008)

roadfix said:


> We're not talking about trading. We're talking about our retirement funds.


 

So sorry.


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## pdswife (Sep 29, 2008)

we are now poor....sigh


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## GhettoRacingKid (Sep 29, 2008)

ohh well I actualyl moved $2000  in my 401K to teh common stock and changed the election in the common from 40% to 65%.

risky but in the long haul ill make out liek crazy.

I made out like a bandit before my 401k crashed recently


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## roadfix (Sep 29, 2008)

pdswife said:


> we are now poor....sigh



...only on paper.  You'll be fine for the long term.


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## pdswife (Sep 29, 2008)

try telling that to my hubby roadfix...he's as low as the market right now...


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## roadfix (Sep 29, 2008)

texasgirl said:


> So sorry.



No need to be sorry.  It's common to equate the stock market to day to day trading.


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## qmax (Sep 29, 2008)

I am off 6 figures for the year.


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## roadfix (Sep 29, 2008)

qmax said:


> I am off 6 figures for the year.


ouch


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## JoeV (Sep 29, 2008)

I few months ago I stopped opening the monthly statements from Oppenheimer. I've been down this path before and there's no reason to add insult to injury by crunching numbers that don't mean anything unless you're going to sell an investment. I ain't sellin, so I ain't lookin neither.  What the hey, it's only money anyway. Let's make a great meal and have a party. It worked for Nero...didn't it?


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## babetoo (Sep 29, 2008)

lol joe, what should i bring? 
babe


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## quicksilver (Sep 29, 2008)

How about some silver dollar pancakes?


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## jpmcgrew (Sep 29, 2008)

quicksilver said:


> How about some silver dollar pancakes?


 
 Millioner's Pie


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## DramaQueen (Sep 29, 2008)

_As of right now, the market is down 777 points (NYSE) the largest single day loss in History.  The whole country is losing money.  I won 800.00 last night in a casino here in Vegas.  I think I'll take all my money and stick it into a slot machine.   The odds are better.  _


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## JoeV (Sep 29, 2008)

DramaQueen said:


> _As of right now, the market is down 777 points (NYSE) the largest single day loss in History.  The whole country is losing money.  I won 800.00 last night in a casino here in Vegas.  I think I'll take all my money and stick it into a slot machine.   The odds are better.  _



Just out of curiosity, how much did you spend to win $800?? I'm always interested in the bottom line...income - expense=profit. We all know it takes money to make money, and there aint no free lunch. High rollers are treated better because they spend more.


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## JoeV (Sep 29, 2008)

DramaQueen said:


> _As of right now, the market is down 777 points (NYSE) the largest single day loss in History.  The whole country is losing money.  I won 800.00 last night in a casino here in Vegas.  I think I'll take all my money and stick it into a slot machine.   The odds are better.  _



If I were in Vegas I'd be playing Blazing 7's.


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## Toots (Sep 29, 2008)

I am meeting with an advisor at Charles Schwab about my 401K next week.  I have 70 percent in the Asian stock market so I shudder to think what has happened to those funds in the past week.


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## Constance (Sep 29, 2008)

I say you haven't lost anything until you sell it. Yes, we're in hard times. Most of ours is General Dynamics and Exxon. If they go down, the economy will be in complete chaos anyway.


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## Saphellae (Sep 29, 2008)

The economy will go back up, as it always has. Stay invested and keep your emotions out of it


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## babetoo (Sep 29, 2008)

i also equate the stock market and gambling the same way. only if i could afford to just throw money in the street, would i invest in either.


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## roadfix (Sep 29, 2008)

babetoo said:


> i also equate the stock market and gambling the same way. only if i could afford to just throw money in the street, would i invest in either.



Then how is your money invested?  Precious metals? CD's? Annuities?
I'm sure we all try to diversify but the stock market always plays a major role, whether you're in it for short term or long term.

As far as gambling goes, I keep some "gambling" money at a brokerage firm where I can trade stocks on-line, everyday, if I wish to.....but that's money that I can afford to lose.


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## TanyaK (Sep 30, 2008)

JoeV said:


> I few months ago I stopped opening the monthly statements from Oppenheimer. I've been down this path before and there's no reason to add insult to injury by crunching numbers that don't mean anything unless you're going to sell an investment. I ain't sellin, so I ain't lookin neither.  What the hey, it's only money anyway. Let's make a great meal and have a party. It worked for Nero...didn't it?



I'm doing the same - not going to sell it and eventually it will go up again so what's the use stressing ?


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## DramaQueen (Sep 30, 2008)

JoeV said:


> Just out of curiosity, how much did you spend to win $800?? I'm always interested in the bottom line...income - expense=profit. We all know it takes money to make money, and there aint no free lunch. High rollers are treated better because they spend more.


 
_Who said there is no such thing as a free lunch? Sure there is. I put in $50 - played for an hour and came away with a ticket for $852. I won $802. Sure there is a free lunch - and dinner too. As a matter of fact this will pay for all of my lunches and dinners on my trip to  Boston in a couple of days.  We'll be there for 8 days. _


_And I agree with you about the bottom line. Most people who gamble don't realize they have to deduct what they started with from what they cash in. I still think the odds are better in Vegas than in the stock market right now.  At least I have a fighting chance.  Pretty scary stuff going on out there. _


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## DramaQueen (Sep 30, 2008)

JoeV said:


> If I were in Vegas I'd be playing Blazing 7's.


 
_Don't think for one minute that it didn't occur to me to do just that.   Triple 7's.  What a coincidence.  However, unlike investing in the market right now, I'm going to quit while I'm ahead.  _


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## NAchef (Sep 30, 2008)

I am married so I lose money EVERY day!!


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## roadfix (Sep 30, 2008)

NAchef said:


> I am married so I lose money EVERY day!!



There's a lot of truth to that.


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## justplainbill (Sep 30, 2008)

I review my portfolio weekly and it's been downhill since 5//16/08 (-5.8% through 9/26/08).


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## GhettoRacingKid (Sep 30, 2008)

I made quite a few bucks today.  at least on paper.  but im in for the long hual and its my 401K anyway so i dont see it anyway.


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## DramaQueen (Sep 30, 2008)

_I just bought a large 5% CD today.  I'm feeling very good._


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## roadfix (Sep 30, 2008)

DramaQueen said:


> _I just bought a large 5% CD today.  I'm feeling very good._


Where and for how long?
I was just looking at ING Direct's 2-yr/4.5% yield CD.

edit:
I realize WAMU has been bought out but that does not concern me.  I just went to their site and they're offering 5% yields on on-line 12 month CD's.  I might buy this.


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## blissful (Sep 30, 2008)

my 201k is hurtin'!


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## DramaQueen (Sep 30, 2008)

roadfix said:


> Where and for how long?
> I was just looking at ING Direct's 2-yr/4.5% yield CD.
> 
> edit:
> I realize WAMU has been bought out but that does not concern me. I just went to their site and they're offering 5% yields on on-line 12 month CD's. I might buy this.


 
_That's where I got it. I've been with them for years and now they're Chase Bank.  ._


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## love2"Q" (Sep 30, 2008)

down a bunch yesterday .. not so bad today ..


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## roadfix (Sep 30, 2008)

DramaQueen said:


> _That's where I got it. I've been with them for years and now they're Chase Bank.  ._



If it's good enough for a gambler like you, it's good enough for me.  I'm buying tomorrow morning.


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## jpmcgrew (Sep 30, 2008)

So are cds airtight as opposed to other acounts like money market? We have a few CDs. Are they part of the FDIC insurance?


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## roadfix (Sep 30, 2008)

jpmcgrew said:


> Are they part of the FDIC insurance?


Most definitely.


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## kmcgra (Sep 30, 2008)

We lost a little bit...but there are still another 20 or 30 years to go before I retire.  So, I guess we are OK, provided the world is still here then.  We are definitely in it for the loooooong haul.

good luck!


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## roadfix (Sep 30, 2008)

My dad thought the WaMu CD was a good deal too.  So I bought tonight.


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## jpmcgrew (Sep 30, 2008)

roadfix said:


> Most definitely.


 
 So what you are saying is that CDs are also vulnerable to great loss?


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## expatgirl (Sep 30, 2008)

You don't lose unless you sell and you don't get into this volatile market unless you are in for the long haul...........


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## expatgirl (Sep 30, 2008)

I've been around long enough to know that it will always get better............you guys and gals hang in there if you're worried.............despite who the next president is........


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## jpmcgrew (Sep 30, 2008)

From what I understand the stock market would be just fine until people panic and start selling off instead of sitting tight. If they would just relax and wait it would not come to this. Am I right or wrong?


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## expatgirl (Sep 30, 2008)

in my bank books you're right on............


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## expatgirl (Sep 30, 2008)

we've taken big hits.........that's the economy now.........but we;re not selling either...........we've also come into some big money in the past........it all evens out in the end.......don't invest $$$ unless you can afford to lose it..........


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## roadfix (Oct 1, 2008)

jpmcgrew said:


> So what you are saying is that CDs are also vulnerable to great loss?


 Most definitely.  Anything can happen, even with the feds...


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## expatgirl (Oct 1, 2008)

expatgirl said:


> we've taken big hits.........that's the economy now.........but we;re not selling either...........we've also come into some big money in the past........it all evens out in the end.......don't invest $$$ unless you can afford to lose it..........


kriss Kristoffersonson is teilling me to let my hair down.........yeah Kriss for you I will.......and I have long hair...........no greys yet.........why i don't know the hell why............I have grey tonails........


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## expatgirl (Oct 1, 2008)

roadfix said:


> ...only on paper.  You'll be fine for the long term.



hey, hang in there, girlfriend............you are not poor...............stop thinking that way or I'm going to smack you one........you are just in a typical American slump..........you'll come out of this or I'm going to smack you one........


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## attie (Oct 1, 2008)

Our retirement funds have coped a hiding but in reality we're doing OK. There is much talk about Aussies buying up realestate in the US at the moment,


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## jpmcgrew (Oct 1, 2008)

Because of this thread I made DH go to town today and put one of his bigger accounts into a different bank so it is insured. He has all his/ our eggs in one bank.


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## Alix (Oct 1, 2008)

Someone said to me recently, "Why is it when the price goes down on anything but stocks people buy like crazy and stock up?"

Makes sense to me. I think if I can scrape together extra cash I'm going to go "shopping". I hear banks are looking for investors.


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## expatgirl (Oct 1, 2008)

heck, yeah,  if you got the money now is the time to buy..........


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## DramaQueen (Oct 1, 2008)

roadfix said:


> Most definitely. Anything can happen, even with the feds...


 
_According to what I know and according to Suzy Orman and several other knowledgable financial experts, CD's are the safest thing you can invest in. Your interest rate will go down only if there is a huge drop in the interest rate and that never happens. Your money is safe and you won't lose anything but you may not collect the high interest rate you started with. But you will retain the principal and any interest you've accrued up to that point. I have had CD's for 30 years and never had one drop a point in interest. This is very safe, that's why I pulled out of the market just before the big drop a couple of days ago. Timed that one right. Bought another large CD this morning at Wamu (now J.P. Morgan Chase)._


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## roadfix (Oct 1, 2008)

DramaQueen said:


> _According to what I know and according to Suzy Orman and several other knowledgable financial experts, CD's are the safest thing you can invest in.  Your interest rate will go down only if there is a huge drop in the interest rate and that never happens.   I have had CD's for 30 years and never had one drop a point in interest.  This is very safe, that's why I pulled out of the market just before the big drop a couple of days ago.  Timed that one right.  Bought another large CD this morning at Wamu (now J.P. Morgan Chase)._



I bought that same WaMu CD last night.  I'm also kicking myself in the butt because I bought 4 CDs (laddered) about 10 days ago at much lower rates elsewhere.
How can the rates go down if it's a fixed CD?  They shouldn't.


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## DramaQueen (Oct 1, 2008)

roadfix said:


> I bought that same WaMu CD last night. I'm also kicking myself in the butt because I bought 4 CDs (laddered) about 10 days ago at much lower rates elsewhere.
> How can the rates go down if it's a fixed CD? They shouldn't.


 
If you buy a 5% CD and for some strange reason the interest rate goes down to 2% it is no longer profitable for the bank to pay you 5% so they will pull your CD. You have the choice of leaving it in at 2% or taking it and going elsewhere to invest it. This has only happened once in 40 years so don't worry. It is a possiblity but not a probability. Before you invest, get the answers you need from your banker. You need to know exactly what you're doing with your money.  When I bought my second CD this morning, I held out a large amount in a money market liquid account so that if the interest rate goes higher, I can put that money in at the higher rate.


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## roadfix (Oct 1, 2008)

DramaQueen said:


> If you buy a 5% CD and for some strange reason the interest rate goes down to 2% it is no longer profitable for the bank to pay you 5% so they will pull your CD. You have the choice of leaving it in at 2% or taking it and going elsewhere to invest it. This has only happened once in 40 years so don't worry. It is a possiblity but not a probability. Before you invest, get the answers you need from your banker. You need to know exactly what you're doing with your money.  When I bought my second CD this morning, I held out a large amount in a money market liquid account so that if the interest rate goes higher, I can put that money in at the higher rate.



Got it.  But as far as the current state, it's highly unlikely the feds will drop major points, if any.
Anyway, I don't think you can go wrong with a 5% yield, and it's only for 12 months.


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## jpmcgrew (Oct 1, 2008)

So what you guys are saying one dos NOT have to have CDs FDIC insured as that money can't be touched other than your interest rate possibly going down? When it comes to finances I'm totally clueless just don't have the brain for it except the basics.


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## roadfix (Oct 1, 2008)

I believe all CDs are insured regardless of which institution you buy it from.


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## jpmcgrew (Oct 1, 2008)

roadfix said:


> I believe all CDs are insured regardless of which institution you buy it from.


 
 Yes but what I'm trying to understand is that your bank will only insure one account with the FDIC up to $100.000 but it will not cover your other accounts meaning one must take other accounts to other banks to get the insurance?


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## roadfix (Oct 1, 2008)

jpmcgrew said:


> Yes but what I'm trying to understand is that your bank will only insure one account with the FDIC up to $100.000 but it will not cover your other accounts meaning one must take other accounts to other banks to get the insurance?


That's 100,000 total per bank regardless of what types or how many different accounts you carry with that particular bank.
If you have more than 100k in one bank, take some of that money and move it to another bank.


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## DramaQueen (Oct 1, 2008)

jpmcgrew said:


> Yes but what I'm trying to understand is that your bank will only insure one account with the FDIC up to $100.000 but it will not cover your other accounts meaning one must take other accounts to other banks to get the insurance?


 
Yes and no. I am insured up to $300,000 because everything is in my trust and my 2 children inherit the trust, therefore they are insured for $100,000 each as am I. Some IRA retirement accounts are insured up to $250,000. Otherwise you are only insured up to $100,000 at any one institution. If you have savings account, CD, money market account etc. and you are the only name on the account you can lose anything over $100,000. If you and your spouse have a joint account, then you are insured for $100,000 each.  BUT remember that your bank or savings institution must carry FDIC insurance to begin with for you to be insured for any amount.


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## roadfix (Oct 8, 2008)




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## Saphellae (Oct 8, 2008)

Financial institutions in Canada are dropping their interest rates on loans up to .5% as of today to kill the credit crunch, as well as different rate drops from other countries as well.  Heard that at work today. Also a bunch of other countries are starting bailout programs like the US.


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## roadfix (Oct 8, 2008)

^^^^  As a result of the fed's action this morning the 5% CD that Drama Queen and I purchased last week has now dropped to 3% as of today.


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## DramaQueen (Oct 10, 2008)

roadfix said:


> ^^^^ As a result of the fed's action this morning the 5% CD that Drama Queen and I purchased last week has now dropped to 3% as of today.


 
_Aren't you glad we bought when we did?  The best rate now is an 8 month CD at 3.9%.  My best friend has as much in her Fidelity account as I put into my 2 CD's 2 weeks ago.    She lost 8,000 dollars in the same amount of time.   I made money.  Sometimes it pays to cut bait.   I'm too old for the "long haul."  LOL._

_All joking aside, this is a very scary situation and I'm afraid for people with families who have most of their money invested in stocks.   _


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## pdswife (Oct 10, 2008)

we've now lost enough to pay off our house... ...


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## roadfix (Oct 10, 2008)

Well, I'm playing poker at home with my in-laws tomorrow night.  Perhaps I can recoup a small fraction of the money I lost the last few days in the market.  Who wants to play?  I'm doing some spare ribs too.  ....


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## Toots (Oct 10, 2008)

I worked up the courage to look at my 401K today and it is down about 25 % since August.  NOT GOOD.  I hopped on the phone and asked Charles Schwab about rebalancing the whole thing to reduce my losses.  Actually the advisor told me that I am still in good shape and with rebalancing and time, I'll be OK.  I guess this is the consolation for knowing that I have to work til I'm 70 ("only" 28 more years to go.....)

I really feel for those who dont have time to make up the losses - the market is not going to right itself anytime soon.


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## Saphellae (Oct 10, 2008)

If you have a good advisor, you should be diversified enough to be able to ride it out. Everyones stocks/bonds are down right now, but they will go back up.  Values fluctuate anyways, this is just a more extreme fluctuation.  Hold onto your stuff! ^^  It is easy for me to say though, I'm in Canada and we are not getting hit as bad.. they actually evaluated the structures of countries and Canada has the best to cope with this kind of thing.


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## Constance (Oct 10, 2008)

We are holding tight. We don't owe anyone any money, except that our insurance costs us $20,000 a year, because we have so many pre-existing conditions. All will be well when we get on Medicare, if it still exists. 

I am glad we taught the grandson how to hunt, catch fish, and make a garden. Who knows what lies ahead?

I do have faith in humankind...I believe we can beat this, if we stick together.

Love and Peace...

Connie

You know, the old hippy in me still says that we can change the world, one person at a time.


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## AmericaWestCMH (Oct 11, 2008)

Made some money daytrading these wild swings.  Still up about 5% for the year.  I'll take it.


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## Toots (Oct 11, 2008)

Constance said:


> You know, the old hippy in me still says that we can change the world, one person at a time.


 

Thank God for old Hippies Connie!  We need more people with this kind of attitude.


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## GotGarlic (Oct 11, 2008)

Toots said:


> I worked up the courage to look at my 401K today and it is down about 25 % since August.  NOT GOOD.  I hopped on the phone and asked Charles Schwab about rebalancing the whole thing to reduce my losses.  Actually the advisor told me that I am still in good shape and with rebalancing and time, I'll be OK.  I guess this is the consolation for knowing that I have to work til I'm 70 ("only" 28 more years to go.....)



You haven't actually lost the money until you sell. Rebalancing is selling one asset to buy more of another. If you were thinking about selling stock to buy more bonds, that's a mistake.

It's funny that people (not you, necessarily, just in general) usually know that the rule is to buy low and sell high, but when the market drops people panic and sell. That's backward 

The thing about CDs is that, while the money is safe, the interest paid may not be enough to beat inflation. For example, if inflation is 5% this year, and you have a CD paying 3%, you're losing 2% of your purchasing power on that money. That's why, for the long term, stocks are a better deal - the average percentage is usually more than the average inflation rate over a period of years.

Personally, though, I don't have the time or inclination to do the work of determining which stocks I should invest in, so I go with stock mutual funds. Just about everything is down right now, but that's the beauty of dollar-cost averaging  I repeat that like a mantra: dollar-cost averaging, dollar-cost averaging , dollar-cost averaging ...


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## roadfix (Oct 11, 2008)

GotGarlic said:


> Personally, though, I don't have the time or inclination to do the work of determining which stocks I should invest in, so I go with stock mutual funds. Just about everything is down right now, but that's the beauty of dollar-cost averaging  I repeat that like a mantra: dollar-cost averaging, dollar-cost averaging , dollar-cost averaging ...



I've never made money trading individual stocks.  I've had much better luck with baskets of stocks like the Q's, for instance, and holding them longer term.  I do this with Etrade.

As for mutual funds I wish I had the discipline to dollar cost average.  I tend to make contributions in spurts.....and always at the wrong time, it seems like.  I've been happy with Vanguard as their fees are very low and service good.


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## justplainbill (Oct 11, 2008)

GotGarlic said:


> The thing about CDs is that, while the money is safe, the interest paid may not be enough to beat inflation. For example, if inflation is 5% this year, and you have a CD paying 3%, you're losing 2% of your purchasing power on that money. That's why, for the long term, stocks are a better deal - the average percentage is usually more than the average inflation rate over a period of years. ..


 
For those who have to pay income tax on their CD income, funds in a CD paying 5% will still suffer erosion of buying power if inflation is at 5%.


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## roadfix (Oct 11, 2008)

Regardless of the inflation rate or tax consequences the bottom line on CD's is that they're more practical than  stashing a lot of cash under the  mattress as I used to do.


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## GotGarlic (Oct 11, 2008)

roadfix said:


> As for mutual funds I wish I had the discipline to dollar cost average.  I tend to make contributions in spurts.....and always at the wrong time, it seems like.  I've been happy with Vanguard as their fees are very low and service good.



We each have 10% of our net income transferred automatically into retirement accounts that are invested in mutual funds. That's what dollar-cost averaging means - invest a specific amount every week, month, whatever, no matter what the price is, and over time, you will accumulate more shares than you would if you tried to time the market.


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## roadfix (Oct 11, 2008)

GotGarlic said:


> We each have 10% of our net income transferred automatically into retirement accounts that are invested in mutual funds. That's what dollar-cost averaging means - invest a specific amount every week, month, whatever, no matter what the price is, and over time, you will accumulate more shares than you would if you tried to time the market.


Yes, I had my financial institution set up for monthy auto invest into my mutual funds. That lasted a few years until I stopped it.  I thought I could do better by timing the market...  Bad move.  I might go back to dollar cost averaging.


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## NAchef (Oct 11, 2008)

I am down 30% for the year.  Yuck!!


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## DramaQueen (Oct 11, 2008)

_Just got back from Boston and New York and as we landed in Vegas I stuck $20 in a slot machine at the airport. Played 6 dollars and hit for $200. Cashed out and went home. I still think the odds are better in a slot machine. _


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