The Price of a bageutte

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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Q[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]uote: [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Firstly, you´re making a wild generalization by comparing "French" baguettes to "USA" baguettes. [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]No I’m not. A baguette is specific French style bread. If its called a baguette in the USA, its supposed to be a baguette, and they are not.[/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Quote: [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]have you ever tried one from Dieppe, or Marseille, or Ramatuelle [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]200+ [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]days of traveling in France, 30,000 road miles + 1 Fr river cruises and 3 ocean cruise with stops in France. In addition to possibly 400 baguettes at lunch and diner, we often bought a baguette for a mid afternoon snack. [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Quote: [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]You can hardly compare bread from two small villages in Utah, [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Yes I can. There is Panerra, Associated Foods, and Kroger. Moreover “small villages” have lower costs than great cities. Example: where we usually shopped when we lived in Washington DC: two baguettes, $2.29 & $3.29. More expensive than village prices [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]($1.99)[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], and way more expensive than Paris [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif](67 cents)[/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Quote: I´ve eaten excellent baguettes in Ohio, New York and Miami. [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]No you haven’t. It might have been good bread, but it was not a baguette. Lying labels do not turn a sow’s [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ear into a silk purse. [/FONT]​


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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]C[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]olmar is the second city of Alsace, one of the culinary capitals of France. The best original definition of a bistro is an Al[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]s[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]a[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]c[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ian restaurant. [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Until new owner Best Westeren ruined it, our favorite restaurant in France was Le Rendezvous de la Chasse at the Grand Hotel Terminus Bristol in Colmar, two stars in the Michelin Guide. At one of our several meals there, we decided to order their famed dessert. There were two of us, so I ordered two. The waiter said, “No.”[/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Then he explained, “One is enough for 2-3 people. I will put you down for one.”[/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]This thing cost $63. How many US restaurants would refuse a $63 order? [/FONT]​
 
To the best of my knowledge, admitedly limited, unlike Champaigne or Pastie, the name baguette is not legally protected.

So my tastes, palette may well appreciate and like far better, a baguette from Boise than a baguette from Paris. It is still a baguette and I think it is better.

and yes, there are plenty of good restaurants, all around the world, not just in France, with excellent waiters and waitresses who will help guide an eater in their choices. Restaurants want their customers to come back.
 
I´ve eaten excellent baguettes in Ohio, New York and Miami.
No you haven’t. It might have been good bread, but it was not a baguette.
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Well I bow to your evidently superior knowledge and experience.
Not only do you understand my own tastes better than I do, but you evidently comprehend that one village in Utah and a small town in Alsace are the ultimate arbiters of classic French patisserie.
Congratulations!
 
kb0000 said:
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Q[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]uote: [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Firstly, you´re making a wild generalization by comparing "French" baguettes to "USA" baguettes. [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]No I’m not. A baguette is specific French style bread. If its called a baguette in the USA, its supposed to be a baguette, and they are not.[/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Quote: [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]have you ever tried one from Dieppe, or Marseille, or Ramatuelle [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]200+ [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]days of traveling in France, 30,000 road miles + 1 Fr river cruises and 3 ocean cruise with stops in France. In addition to possibly 400 baguettes at lunch and diner, we often bought a baguette for a mid afternoon snack. [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Quote: [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]You can hardly compare bread from two small villages in Utah, [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Yes I can. There is Panerra, Associated Foods, and Kroger. Moreover “small villages” have lower costs than great cities. Example: where we usually shopped when we lived in Washington DC: two baguettes, $2.29 & $3.29. More expensive than village prices [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]($1.99)[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], and way more expensive than Paris [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif](67 cents)[/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Quote: I´ve eaten excellent baguettes in Ohio, New York and Miami. [/FONT]​
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]No you haven’t. It might have been good bread, but it was not a baguette. Lying labels do not turn a sow’s [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ear into a silk purse. [/FONT]​


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Are you comparing factory made baguette, bought in a supermarket to the baguettes in France? That could explain the problem. Baguette should come from a bakery. Admittedly, I don't live in the US. I live in Québec, Canada. I have never bought baguette in a supermarket unless it was made in the bakery at the store. I don't think I have ever bought a baguette that had a label calling it a baguette or anything else.
 
kb0000 said:
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]This is a reasonable attitude, with one exception-- that the French produce superior bread for a much lower price means you should be really mad at USA’s capitalist corporate rip off economy. What’s killing your pocket book corporate manipulation of the price of the basics, like bread and gas, and its all caused by corporate corruption. . [/FONT]


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French baguettes are cheap by law--a hangover from the revolution--not because France is free of rip-off capitalists. I don't know about other US cities, but good baguettes are available in New York for anywhere from $1.99 (Trader Joe's) to $5 (fancy bakeries). A problem is that many people think a baguette is merely a long cylindrical loaf of bread. Not so. It is a very long, very skinny cylindrical loaf made solely of flower, yeast, water and salt, given a long rising time, contains no preservatives, and is baked in a steam oven. It starts going stale on the way home from the market and must be eaten the same day; ideally the same morning, and preferably with French salt-flaked butter. When in Paris, always go to a bakery that doesn't provide a bag--just a slim wrap of paper for a hand grip--because bags are the enemy of crispness. Anyone who wants a good baguette in the US can probably find one if he'll take the trouble to look.
 
kb0000 said:
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]In an earlier post, I pointed out that there are no good USA baguettes compared to the French originals. Here, I look at the price of USA’s third rate bread. The price of a baguette in UT's Heber City and Park City grocery stores ranges form $2.49 to $8. The price at the largest supermarket in Paris is 67 cents.



Wasting your money on a third rate USA baguette is monumental rip off. Don’t do it. [/FONT]​
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Actually, French supermarket baguettes are usually second-rate. When in Paris, I buy at the boulanger--at the reallty small. neighborhood ones, I can even meet the baker.
 
karadekoolaid said:
Firstly, you´re making a wild generalisation by comparing "French" baguettes to "USA" baguettes. I don´t doubt that Parisian baguettes are excellent; but have you ever tried one from Dieppe, or Marseille, or Ramatuelle?
Then you talk about Heber City and Park City. You can hardly compare bread from two small villages in Utah, with a combined population of less than 25,000, to that produced in a huge city like Paris. Nor can you compare prices: a pint of beer in Australia is not the same price as a pint in London, Bonn, Prague or Milan. Different economies.Statistically speaking, a non-comparison. Like comparing bananas with potatoes.
Evidently you prefer French baguettes, but to say US baguettes are 3rd rate is an extreme, utterly subjective comment. I´ve eaten excellent baguettes in Ohio, New York and Miami.
Disdainful generalisations about one country or another country´s food are not a good starting point for discussion.
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Hear, hear! Also please note that the law of supply and demand applies. Are Heber City and Park awash in baguette-lovers? If not, the demand has to go to the supply--not necessarily to Paris. Possibly Salt Lake City, a mere 40-odd miles off, will suffice. It's also worth noting that the baguette as we know it today is a creature of the 1990s, when it began to recover from decades of decline with the help of annual and fiercely competitive Best Baguette contests. (S.L. Kaplan's 'Good Bread Is Back' has all the details.)
 
pepperhead212 said:
:LOL: :ROFLMAO: :LOL:

I haven't bought a loaf of bread since 1976 - I only remember the year because of an injury, and I couldn't knead bread dough, so I got a KA mixer for Christmas! I had started making bread to save money - back then, a pound of white bread cost 3¢ to make, whole grain breads 15-17¢ a pound. Now, it is still one of the biggest savers, compared to store bought, and once you've mastered the art of baking it, it is much better. Even using artisan flour, since very little other ingredients are used - just flour, yeast, water, and salt - a pound loaf is under a dollar, and if using a starter, even less. Of course I can't duplicate the wood fired ovens of some bakeries, but those are the exception to the rule. I don't make many white breads anymore, just for occasional dinners; the rye breads are my favorites, though I still don't make them frequently. But it saves a lot of money, when I do, and I couldn't find bread like that anywhere, around here.
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Not only are wood-fired ovens rare, they're unnecessary: no commercial baker in the US or France is baking with wood, and commercial bakers supply all but a decimal percentage of great baguettes. Even a home gas or electric oven will suffice. And with so many baguette tutorials available on YouTube, I'm ready to try my hand. And as you say, the savings are terrific.
 
I find arguing about bread to be counterproductive--hard to talk or type when your mouth is full of good homemade bread.
Sorry for the short post, but I need to check the rise on my French bread dough now.
 
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